I'm sending in my order form for a new Marvel wheelchair later today. I've done a lot of research and I'm pretty excited about it. Marvel won out for me over Tilite, Lasher and Topend.

This will be my second chair since my injury 17 months ago. I'm in a Quickie GT right now. It's been an acceptable ride, but I wanted something different.

I'll post some pictures and comments on my new chair after I've spent some time in it.

looks a nice chair, the webb site is quite interesting, will be keen to see photos of your chair and reports of how you get on with it, certainly looks interesting.

can i ask you what you paid for it? i looks very interesting. i might want one.

Why the hell is it that prices never feature on these websites? Or is it a case of "if you have to ask, you probably can't afford it"? Bloody frustrating

That's probably the case. Justification to insurance companies, medicare and the like would be pretty difficult as well, I would think.

What I want to know is what kind of vehicle you would have to drive to be able to have room for the thing. The frame is huge. I would think either a van/minivan, or a pickup truck with a lift in the bed. I see people at Turning Point events with chairs like the Colours Boing and Quickie XTR, and I wonder how in the world they get those things into the vehicle.

The reason they use titanium isn't just strength or light weight. The light weight and strength allow for compact frames so that they are easier to lead/unload. I have a Quickie GTi with full suspension, and it soaks up plenty of shock. The difference between it and my old GPV is amazing. The GTi is much easier to load too.

Some other questions.
What's the total weight of the chair?

What's the transport weight (weight without rear wheels)?

What's the minimum front/rear seat height?

How much effect does the suspension have on COG? With it being set up where the seat pivots at the front and the back of the seat sinks, I can see the arc of the seat travel causing a tipover pretty easily. I'm wondering what has been done to counter this.

What's the main reason for getting one?

That chair look awesome, I'm interested in the price too, I might consider one.

I'll be sure to post as soon as I get a good feel for it. Should have it in about a week or so.



The retail price for the chair is $5,460. That's not what I paid, as with most chairs, you can expect a discounted price. Currently, Marvels are only available in Canada and the USA (UK by Fall 2009). I dealt directly with Marvel because they don't have a dealer in my area. Their dealer network is just now being established in the USA. The person I dealt with, and the person you should contact if interested, is Scott Giambalvo. If they have a dealer in your area he will refer you to them and you will have to deal directly with them to negotiate your price. I found the price I paid to be comparable to a built out Tilite or Topend and cheaper than the Lasher.



I'm with you on this Greybeard. Wouldn't it be a lot easier just to put the price out there? I guess, maybe they want that customer contact that they might not get if they post their prices up front?



To answer your questions in order:

I personally drive a Honda Odyssey with a VMI in-floor ramp, so I could pretty much push what ever I wanted to as I don't break down the chair. With my injury level I could easily drive a "normal" car and break down the chair to stow inside. After much debate, I chose to not wear down my shoulders with the transfers and dragging the chair in behind me. Just a personal choice as I know most people have an aversion of minivans. I also like the fact that I can roll straight in and not get stuck in the rain or snow while transferring body and chair. With that said, I'm not following the "huge" frame comment. The frame itself is rather small in comparison to the "conventional" frames. You might be referring to the frame and the caster wing together? The chair breaks down into four parts (all by quick release): 2 wheels, frame and caster wing. This should allow you to continue driving whatever it is you currently drive.

The total weight of the chair is somewhere around 22 pounds depending on frame size. This is a true weight with the full suspension, wheels, backrest, transfer handles, etc.

I don't know the actual transport weight, but it should be fairly light considering that the frame and the caster wing are separate?

The seat height can range from 14.5" to 21", front and rear.

The suspension is fully adjustable and independent of the wheels. There are settings for psi, rebound and compression. Also, it can be totally locked out with the flip of a switch while still seated in the chair.

The main reason for getting one is to roll my ass around all day. Seriously though, my reasons are: true suspension which will hopefully help with my lower back pain; the castor wing is removed by quick release and looking forward to the release of an off-road front end which can be paired with the off-road wheels and tires I purchased which will basically allow me to have two chairs in one that can be switched in less than a minute; adjustability - every setting except for seat depth is adjustable, with most all adjustments being made while still in the chair; and finally, I think it looks cool and it's different, which is something I need since I'm a lame-ass nerd that drives a minivan!

I think you refer to just the frame itself, while I refer to frame and seat together as the frame. I understand the frame by itself isn't all that large, but when you include the seat, the chair would definitely be hell to load into a smaller vehicle or smaller cab. It wouldn't fit between me and the steering wheel in my Ranger Sport. (I'm about 5'9" and 150lbs.) I get the reasons for the minivan, just can't use one where I drive a lot (off road and dirt roads). And leaving the chair in the back without being able to strap it down isn't a good idea.LOL.

How do you adjust front seat to floor height?

How do you like the constantly changing rear seat to floor height/dump/center of gravity?

Does the caster wing pivot? If so, how far?

What has been done to correct the COG issue?
(As the suspension has the hinge in front of the seat, the seat travel arch would mean that going over anything big (curbs) the seat angle would change during shock absorbtion, causing the rider to be leaned back. Even a slight lean, changes the rider's COG. Enough of a change can cause tipover and cracked noggin. So if you have to lock the suspension for the bigger stuff, how is it helping there?

The breakdown system sounds good, but just can't justify using a chair that changes COG on it's own. You are getting something different though.

Self examination, like that , is rare...

I checked it out on their web site, and it does look cool. I will be looking forward to your critique. Hope it works for you.
ed

The front seat to floor height is the one adjustment that takes a little time. I discussed this with the Marvel rep before I decided to purchase and he estimated it would take about 15 minutes to make the adjustment, which is achieved by using a spacer kit provided with the wheelchair.

I don't foresee the COG issue as being a problem. I intend to initially set the suspension on the stiff side until I get used to it. I will gradually loosen it up as I feel needed or comfortable. Any absorption of jolts to my spine will be much appreciated. I may be wrong and you may be right.... I'll let you know.

My chair ships today and I should have it by the first of next week. I'll be sure to post some pictures as soon as I get a chance. I will also answer all questions and give a review after I have spent some time in the chair.

how is the chair working now (after the trial period..)? be cool to know as i wish to try one myself!

I am really interested in this chair too...i think ill make it my next. The suspension is the deal maker for me since other chairs with suspension are way too heavy...

I've had my Marvel chair for a couple of weeks now. I've been waiting to post until I got a good feel for it and to get some things sorted. I'll just go from the start and I'm sorry if it gets a little long-winded.

I got home from physical therapy on Thursday two weeks ago and much to my delight there were three boxes setting at my front door. I drag them inside and find that one box contains the frame and the seat and the other two boxes contain my wheels, a set of everyday wheels/tires and a set of offroad wheels/tires.

I put the everyday wheels on, put the correct amount of air in, and take off through the house. Initial impression was "hey this thing is awesome". I have a long straight hallway in my house, so I can get up some decent speed and then there is a transition piece into the tiled kitchen which normally gives me a good jolt in my old chair. Well, the suspension really softened the blow and seemed to smooth out the bumps from the tile.

About this time, my brother comes by and we proceed to fine tune the chair. When Marvel says this chair is adjustable, they're not lying. We were able to quickly adjust the back seat height, wheel spacing, dump, fender spacing, transfer handle spacing, seat to footrest height, shock settings, and look over the other settings. Marvel had the chair pretty close to how I wanted it and all the adjustments we made were minor.

I got back in the chair and took it outside to test it out. Again, it really felt good. It seemed to glide over the cracks in the sidewalk, instead of the jolting I received in the Quickie. It also feels more compact, as there's no tubing coming down by my knees to the foot rest. I can get closer to my couch, bed, etc. which makes for a shorter transfer distance.

To answer previous questions about the shock and the center of gravity....... I didn't notice any problems with this. If anything, my balance seemed to be easier to maintain with the Marvel. I didn't have any trouble with wheelies, small curbs, etc., before, but I did notice that they seemed to be easier in the Marvel, especially hopping curbs.

That's the good stuff. Now for the not so good.

When I came back inside and transferred to the couch, my brother starts taking another look at the chair and says that the left tire looks a little low. He checked the pressure and sure enough it was low. Well, he determined that there was a hole in the tube. So, since I had the offroad set of wheels, we thought this would be a good time to test them out. So I try to take off the right wheel and can't get it to budge. My brother gives it a shot and he fails to get it off. The damn thing is stuck. Not wanting to damage something, we decide to give it a rest for the day.

I call my sales rep (Scott) at Marvel on Saturday and he relays the message to the owners, Jeff Adams and Christian Bagg. I played phone tag with both Jeff and Christian for a couple of days. Mostly my fault because I've been occupied with other things here lately. Eventually I get Jeff on the phone and he tells me what he thinks is wrong and how to go about fixing it. There was some bonding agent that had seeped into the axle sleeve. We get the wheel off and perform some cleaning and lubricating and now the wheel and axle work just fine.

Oh, during my trouble shooting process, the other everyday tire decides to give up and shot it's air out in frustration. So now I have two flat everyday tires.

I must say that Marvel (Scott, Jeff, and Christian) were very apologetic and helpful during my troubles. They sent me some extra tubes and were quite generous in compensating me for my time.

Other than the wheel and tire troubles, there were some other issues.

While I like the look and the compactness of the frame, it has taken me some time to get use to not having the front tubes when adjusting my seating position. I never did use them during an actual transfer, but apparently I did rely on them to scoot out to the edge of the seat. Marvel provides the option of installing transfer handles to help in this area. After some practice I have adapted to using the handles instead of the tubes, though, it would be good if they were a couple of inches longer.

At this time if I needed some help getting up some stairs, I would be SOL. There is no place for someone to easily grab to pull the chair up. Marvel is currently testing a grab handle and said they would ship me one when they are ready.

Initially, I found the front caster wing (foot plate) to be a little tight. I ordered the largest size at 10 inches. After riding in the chair for a while now, I actually find it to be working out great. It's just like everything else.... change takes a little getting use to. Like, when I got my first chair, my initial reaction was... " this thing sucks". But, after I got accustomed to it, I decided it wasn't so bad.

Overall, I've found that all of the initial issues I had with the Marvel have been resloved by getting accustomed to them or changing the way I think about the wheelchair.
Except for the lack of places for people to help me up stairs. This could be a positive though...... if my in-laws want me to come to their house, I can just say "sorry you have too many entry steps and there's no way to carry me in".

That's it for now. I've got to say I'm loving this chair, despite some of the issues I've had. I hope to get some pictures up soon.

Glad you're happy with the chair! It is certainly interesting looking, but I looked at the COG issue and have a hunch...

The angle of the swingarm (to borrow a motorcycle term, referring to the tube that connects the axle to the suspension pivot) is angled quite a bit from horizontal, in a direction that would steepen the swingarm angle even more when you're doing a wheelie (as you do when you go down a curb, steps, rocky hills, etc...).

With such an angle, the rear wheels will "move back" when a bump is hit (like when landing from a curb). I have the problem, though to a lesser degree, on my XTR.

The result is that when you land, it feels as if someone shoves you forward on the shoulders and the front end slams down...

The reason is that as the wheels move back upon landing, it is the same as suddenly moving your COG forward. (I have been unceremoniously launched out of my chair many times because of this going down steep rocky and bumpy hills and have the scratches on the frame to prove it. )

On my XTR, the swingarm is pretty much horizontal at rest. When I'm in a wheelie, it (and the chair) is tipped back approximately 15 degrees. The XTR has almost 2 inches of wheel travel and I use most or all of that pretty often when landing from tall curbs, steps, etc.

I drew the angles in AutoCAD and found the rear wheels move back almost a half inch at full bump.

It appears that the Marvel would have a more pronounced rearward movement due to the steeper angle of the swingarm...

Do you notice any effect like that?

Wow this is getting really technical...I like this a lot. Can't wait to see those pics @araitn. I'm thinking about getting an M1 by this summer.

Not noticed any problems like that, but I've only been down a three or four inch curb. I'll definitely do some testing on it and report back.

Here's my AutoCAD rendering; sort of a cutaway view so you can see everything... (My 6" Frog Legs front and 26" rear wheel are depicted for scale.)

This is, obviously, in "rest" position (as if I were just sittin' there drinkin' an adult beverage - or sumthin')...

I have to admit though, this chair can't be anywhere near as difficult to handle as the Trevair! Have you guys checked it out on the other thread? It's a wheelchair for the Baja 1000...

Trevair Topic

Trevair on youtube

Nope, hadn't seen that one! Thanks, Jax.

Back in the mid 80's I sketched some suspension designs and one of 'em looked sorta like that (geometry-wise). I've been wanting to try (build) independent rear suspension on a chair since way back then... (Been into off-road racing a long time.) Now I see it really does work well!

Funny thing though: The swingarm angle and pivot location on the Trevair is very similar to the Marvel's... I watched the video, trying to see if you could notice the front getting slammed down, but I couldn't really tell. I think you'd need a slow motion side view to see it definitively. Wish I had a slow-mo video camera...

Here's a link with a LOT of info about the Marvel, started by a Marvel sales rep: http://sci.rutgers.edu/forum/showthread.php?t=115685

You made a wise choice! I will be receiving my Marvel M1 in a couple of days and I have never been more stoaked about getting a chair than I am about getting this one. Scott, also one of the co-founders, was great with helping me order and size over the phone. In 8 yeas, this will be my 3rd chair. I will post some pictures, as well as feedback.

You are for sure right about beating out Lasher, TiLite, Quickie, Colours, Invacare, and Kuschall which I'm in now. The Marvel is truely a marvel.

nobody has posted any pictures!!! please guys if you can show us the ins and outs of this chair!

Still liking the new chair. I am very interested aswell

I just had 4 Marvel m1s arrive on my door step having recently become the new zealand distributor.

Firstly i was very impressed with the smaller boxing size compared to regular chairs. It is going to make for much cheaper shipping costs.

Secondly, what stuck me is the quality of the engineering. they are a pleasure to work on really.

I have been busily adjusting the chair over the last day or so but am very impressed with the ride. dropping off gutters and up gutters is a dream having removed all the jarring and boucing.

There is still a little way to go to achieve the setup i am after but beats buying a fixed chair and getting it wrong. 5 minutes with 3x allen keys and it is ready to go.

The rouge tempest ti wheels are noticably lighter than my spinergys and look good also.

I am looking forward to getting some more time in the chair but am impressed (fortunately, given i got 4 sight unseen).

ye I totally agree. been loving my m1 so far. can't see myself using anything else. I have even gone as far as going down 3 stairs without discomfort. I'm really impressed with the chair.

lets see some pictures.

I've contacted my local dealer here and they said they had some demo chairs and asked the measurements of my chair to see if they had one they could set up for me to try. I replied with the measurements, but that was 3 weeks ago and I haven't heard back from em. Dallas is a pretty good size community of people in manual chairs, so I do hope the company Marvel is using here is worth it. I know of several others that I would have chosen and I'd never have heard of the one that is the distributor here if I hadn't found em on the Marvel website.

Heres some pics...

a guy on my hockey team has one of these, and he tore (yes tore) the frame. He's a big guy, and he was coming off of a curb. The dealer couldnt believe it. He got a free replacement, of course.

Just to clarify this a little.......the frame didn't "tear", and he was coming out of a hunting blind.

What happened was that one of the clamps that hold the axle plug in the axle hadn't been tightened correctly after making an adjustment, and the axle plug slid out past the minimum insertion point, leaving the axle tube unsupported. When he came down out of the hunting blind, his weight was enough to break the axle tube.

Click to view attachment

You can see in the photo that the axle tube wasn't inserted far enough (it needs to go in past the weld). This wasn't an issue that falls within the warranty technically, but because we didn't have a "minimum insertion" marking on the axle tube, we comped him a new frame.

(Not trying to make us look like angels or anything, it just seemed like the right thing to do as we should have put that marking on the axle tube)

@texaswheelz - can you email me directly on who the dealer was? jeff@marvelwheelchairs.com - I'd also really appreciate any recommendation that you might have for a dealer that you prefer.