82 replies to this topic

[Swordfish]

I just realized... I've never learned nor attempted to learn popping a wheelie!

I saw someone today in a wheel chair popping a wheelie, and mantaining it and climbing up a few stairs which I had asked someone earlier to help me over. It really inspired me!

I see people popping wheelies in those "hospital" chairs. Even the guy I saw today. I have a ... well "regular" everyday wheel-chair. With foam and gel cushions... surely they weigh more and so would be harder to pull a wheelie.

anyway... any tips? horror stories? tricks? concerns? bla bla?

[Santa Cruz Soul Surfer (LRO)]

Well without launching into a huge discussion, most of the control you have while moving in a wheelie, is derived from trunk control and your ability to grip and control your rims quickly...So, if you don't have good trunk control or upper body strength, I would'nt recommend you trying to jump up curbs anytime soon.

[E-DOG]

Oh yea, I've heard some stories. Can't verify 'em but took 'em to heart anyway.
Heard about 2 or 3 paras who went over backwards and quaded themselves.
Ain't gonna say they're true an' I ain't gonna say they ain't and you can call me a chickenshit all day long but I don't do wheelies PERIOD

Maybe I'm quadraphobic if there is such a thing.
Or maybe I'm becoming an old fuddiduddy.
Oh shit! I'm turning into my dad! aaaahhhhhhhh!!!!

E

[Stickman]

I learned how to do them in rehab, it sure helps going over curbs and other things that would be pretty bumpy and get the cloness goin on. I havent tried stairs yet, that seems pretty risky for me right now. Good luck to you.

[Ches]

Im such a grl when it comes to wheelies. Not interested, thanks.

I know how, but I get nervous, won't hold it..

The worse part of learning has to be the falling out, cause getting back in is a bitch. All to crawl in and try again...

Have fun.

[twisted_ophelia]

I can do wheelies but as Christiaan said, it's got a lot to do with trunk control. AB people can pop wheelies no problem and do chair tricks because they can 'cheat' and use their abs/trunk/hips, etc., to balance. On my current chair, I have trouble holding wheelies. I can pop one no problem but can't really sustain it without losing my balance because the back is really low and even at T8, I don't have all the ab control I need to not fall over backwards. Going over backwards is very unpleasant. I had no issues on my previous chairs which I had higher backs on and could wheelie/sustain mostly without issue.

Wheelies are very useful when it comes to day-to-day stuff in the great outdoors ie. for curb jumping, getting over obstacles. I think they add to independence. I can't climb or descend stairs in my chair. My upper body is really strong but I find that I don't have enough strength to do it. If I need to get up a flight of stairs and there's no one around to give me a hand, I just get out of my chair and drag my ass up step by step and pull my chair along with me. I can do escalators in my chair but I don't do it much anymore after watching that HORRIFIC chair escalator accident video on youtube (I'm sure most of you know which video I'm talking about!).

[Kev-O]

I dont go a day without having to pop a wheelie at some point. A good way to learn is put your wheelie bars on an put them as high up as you can or atleast high enough to were you can find your blance point. if you cant do that tie a rope to the back of your chair an have an AB stand behind you an hold that rope. pop a wheelie an if you start falling backwards they can tug the rope an it will keep you from busting your ass. Just keep working on it an you'll get the hang of it. Like Santa Cruz said tho if you cant grip your push rim good ya might not be able to do it. If you keep doing it tho you'll get better an it will become second nature. Sometimes i'll be talkin to people an not relyze it but i'll be in a wheelie. Oh yeah an at first the positon of your head is importent. use your head as kinda like a counter weight. if your falling back move it forward if your going forward move it back. good luck

PS E-Dog an ches you chicken shits lol

Edited by Kev-O, 12 June 2009 - 04:08 AM.

[Texaswheelz]

yea I can't think of a day that goes by when I haven't done a wheelie for some reason or another. Hell every day I leave work i jump the curb as the ramp to get up on the sidewalk to the front door is to far out of the way. A good way I found was to practice while setting on front of your couch, that way if you fall over backwards you don't go to far and you can get back up pretty easy from laying back on your couch.

As far as falling out of the chair if you fall over, yea it happens, but I might fall over once a year these day, but get out of my chair and onto the ground on purpose much more often. Getting back in used to be the hardest damn thing around, now it's pretty easy to get back in and I can do it several different ways. Just takes practice and a little muscle.

[Bevan-L]

pretty much have to on a day to day basis otherwise i wouldnt be able to get into anything.... I'm a T4 but lately i've been able to push and just roll on the back wheels and control it. before I could harly balance and went over backwards twice... scared me but you just gotta get back into it....

just comes down to control... work at it, you'll get it

[Beautiful]

Oh my gosh, I am a wheelie maniac. I am only like 6 weeks into my recovery from my spinal fusion, and I am not even supposed to be doing them, but its fun for me. I can sit in a wheelie position for hours! I also try and hold my wheelie and wheel around the house. Never tried to go up or down stairs, except the front porch of some houses. I can go up curbs too. I've fallen a few times, but someone just picks me back up, and I learned how to get back into my chair on my own. Love wheelies!

[percepied]

If you have anti-tipper bars on your chair, you might be able to replace them with a straight piece of metal tubing (something that won't break) that will allow you to practice wheelies w/o tipping over backwards. You can't use them to practice stairs or curbs though. That will take a spotter or two, lots of practice and maybe some headgear. Plus you have to be completely confident and fearless.

Personally I say let the super-gimps do the wheelies. I've already broken enough bones.

[Swordfish]

percepied, on Jun 12 2009, 04:45 AM, said:

If you have anti-tipper bars on your chair, you might be able to replace them with a straight piece of metal tubing (something that won't break) that will allow you to practice wheelies w/o tipping over backwards. You can't use them to practice stairs or curbs though. That will take a spotter or two, lots of practice and maybe some headgear. Plus you have to be completely confident and fearless.

Personally I say let the super-gimps do the wheelies. I've already broken enough bones.

what do you mean? I have anti-tip bars, but what the heck are you talking about with replacing it?

[CR_L1]

Again, the same as others, I pop little wheelies every day to get up kerbs but thats my limit. As a kid I never found the balance point on a bike, wheelies have never been my thing. A para friend of mine has tried to teach me with no luck so far.

[wheelinPEACE]

I do wheelies and can hold one but I'm to chicken to jump a curb. How do u lose the fear? I've been in my chair for 12 years and still have a fear that prevents me from jumping curbs, attempting steps, or any of the like. I figure ....and please don't anyone get mad....I'm chicken because I'm a girl.

13 years, not 12...sorry I lost a year....lol

Edited by wheelinPEACE, 12 June 2009 - 07:31 AM.

[russ1]

Yeah - can't imagine having to use a chair without popping the odd wheelie everyday - and it's not about trunk control at all it's about balance. As T2 complete I have nil trunk control but can hold a wheelie to roll across gravel or roll down steep slopes quite happily - it's also often easier to hold a wheelie to roll across grass. It's not so much about the actual weight of the chair as the way it's set up and the centre of gravity. The tippier the chair the easier it is to pull a wheelie, once up however holding the wheelie is no different.

Really really useful skill to master but many people manage without, but makes going up and down small steps easily manageable which opens up many more areas to you.

[Travelling Blackbird]

As everyone's said, a wheelie requires trunk control. I'd add that it also requires a good sense of balance and coordination, and a chair with the right centre of gravity.

I couldn't do proper wheelies in my second chair, which, although it was light and maneuverable, was a little top heavy (probably due to not actually being made for me). I could get the castors a little off the ground, but if I didn't drop them fast, I'd wobble violently and then fall backwards. I'll admit, an element of that would also be down to crappy co-ordination, because at the time, I was still relearning how to move (head injury).

My tip would be to learn on grass. Not only is it a softer landing if one does fall, I also found it easier because the traction on the wheels made it easier to balance for a while. And stay well away from trees - roots in the grass make for a hard, uneven surface. Also, as mentioned above, get someone to be with you when you're trying, and use your anti-tipping bars at first. Get used to the movement before you try to do it solo.

My concern would be that your injury is high, and your trunk strength and arm co-ordination probably aren't great. I don't know, but it'd be irresponsible not to voice that concern. Falling happens to all of us, but falling backwards is particularly dangerous, and you don't want to get reinjured. Ultimately, being able to wheelie is handy, but it's not essential, so don't put yourself at unnecessary risk.

[Travelling Blackbird]

russ1, on Jun 12 2009, 11:32 AM, said:

Yeah - can't imagine having to use a chair without popping the odd wheelie everyday - and it's not about trunk control at all it's about balance.

That's an interesting way to look at it. I feel like it's my chest and core that are doing the work, so I assumed trunk control is a big part of it. I know balance is crucial too... do you feel like there's any difference in the muscles that are working when you wheelie?

russ1, on Jun 12 2009, 11:32 AM, said:

As T2 complete I have nil trunk control but can hold a wheelie to roll across gravel or roll down steep slopes quite happily - it's also often easier to hold a wheelie to roll across grass.

I also find them easier on gravel, in snow or on grass, like the surface helps. They're really difficult to hold for any length of time on lino!

russ1, on Jun 12 2009, 11:32 AM, said:

It's not so much about the actual weight of the chair as the way it's set up and the centre of gravity. The tippier the chair the easier it is to pull a wheelie, once up however holding the wheelie is no different.

Definitely a centre of gravity issue: my tall second chair and I weren't compatible, as I mentioned, but the later chairs that were designed for me were much better.

[adam_downunder]

There is already a lot of discussion so far about the pro's of being able to back wheel balance so I'm not going to go on with too much.

What I do want to add though, as russ mentioned is that YOU DO NOT NEED TRUNK to back wheel balance. I am C7 complete and I back wheel balance fine, as does pretty much everyone I play rugby with and many of them have very limited use of their hands.

If you haven't picked this up yet, I would suggest learning, it is one of those things that seems impossible at first, but once you get it that first time, you'll be right from there.

Travelling Blackbird, on Jun 12 2009, 08:19 PM, said:

russ1, on Jun 12 2009, 11:32 AM, said:

Yeah - can't imagine having to use a chair without popping the odd wheelie everyday - and it's not about trunk control at all it's about balance.

That's an interesting way to look at it. I feel like it's my chest and core that are doing the work, so I assumed trunk control is a big part of it. I know balance is crucial too... do you feel like there's any difference in the muscles that are working when you wheelie?

If your core muscles are going nuts correcting your balance rapidly, you need to learn to relax, take it easy and make slight movements. Use your head and shoulders to find the right balance point.

[russ1]

Travelling Blackbird, on Jun 12 2009, 11:19 AM, said:

russ1, on Jun 12 2009, 11:32 AM, said:

Yeah - can't imagine having to use a chair without popping the odd wheelie everyday - and it's not about trunk control at all it's about balance.

That's an interesting way to look at it. I feel like it's my chest and core that are doing the work, so I assumed trunk control is a big part of it. I know balance is crucial too... do you feel like there's any difference in the muscles that are working when you wheelie?

To be honest you use your arms to pull the wheelie, it's just a sharp push. Once up in the wheelie position it's a case of small movements on the wheels with the hands to keep the contact point under your centre of gravity and you can also use your head for fine balance. A good practice is to try to hold the wheelie one handed (I have friends who can drink a pint of beer while holding a wheelie with one hand, an impressive party trick). There's really nil core muscles involved, the more you relax the easier it is. Getting into a deep back wheel balance position is tricky without core muscles (but possible) so I guess that most people using their core muscles when back wheel balancing aren't using their backrests on their chairs for support as if you have the ability to lean forward then I guess that it's the natural thing to do to counteract the feeling of going over backwards. Try not to do this if you're trying to learn as it will make it more difficult. Lean back and use the wheels and fine head movements. once you can do that way then start leaning forward to go into a deeper back wheel balance and start using your trunk muscles.

When I said about grass I meant that moving over the grass was easier while holding a wheelie as opposed to pushing on four wheels and having the front castors digging in, i've never really noticed that maintaining a wheelie was easier on grass although the soft landing does make for much more confidence when practicing.

[knightrider]

Its has **Nothing to do with trunk control**, just as Russ said, its all about finding the balance point, I know quads at c5/6 holding wheelies and popping wheelies down hills. Its all about finding that point and small movements, your head plays a big part in it too, if your head is forwards then the chair will be harder to hold in a wheelie, and if your head is back then.....well your out lol.

Well Russ is spot on with his points.

Edited by knightrider, 12 June 2009 - 11:58 AM.

[knightrider]

Oh and another point, if your going to learn, have an AB behind you so they can catch you if you tip over. Plus its a quicker way to find your balance point. Once you got your chair up into a wheelie don't push and pull on the wheels too much, just small movements and if you feel like your going to fall back just lean foward or just your head/shoulders and pull back on the wheels.
Once you found that point of balance you got it, prob takes about 30mins - hour of trying. once you got it you'l never forget, just like riding a bike....well not anymore LOL but you know what i mean.

Learning wheelies is a must i think, because is a good skill to have, especially when wheeling over uneven places, gravel, grass, down steep hills, up and down curbs/steps etc.

Russ, just to add, doing deep wheel balance, you don't need trunk control to do that either, i'm T6 and can do it no problem and i know a T2 who can do it also, its all about confidence lol.

twisted_ophelia, on Jun 12 2009, 04:50 AM, said:

I can do escalators in my chair but I don't do it much anymore after watching that HORRIFIC chair escalator accident video on youtube (I'm sure most of you know which video I'm talking about!).

LMAO same here, that vid put me right off

Edited by knightrider, 12 June 2009 - 12:00 PM.

[Travelling Blackbird]

adam_downunder, on Jun 12 2009, 12:24 PM, said:

What I do want to add though, as russ mentioned is that YOU DO NOT NEED TRUNK to back wheel balance. I am C7 complete and I back wheel balance fine, as does pretty much everyone I play rugby with and many of them have very limited use of their hands.

That's good to know. So, there you go, Swordfish, you can learn to pop a wheelie with a high injury. I'll change my concern to: "Just be careful learning".

adam_downunder, on Jun 12 2009, 12:24 PM, said:

Travelling Blackbird, on Jun 12 2009, 08:19 PM, said:

I feel like it's my chest and core that are doing the work, so I assumed trunk control is a big part of it. I know balance is crucial too... do you feel like there's any difference in the muscles that are working when you wheelie?

If your core muscles are going nuts correcting your balance rapidly, you need to learn to relax, take it easy and make slight movements. Use your head and shoulders to find the right balance point.

Relaxing may be a big part of the issue with me doing the wheelie incorrectly. I have problems relaxing in general, and even after all the years of physio, I still have co-ordination problems. I've get the shakes if I hold a wheelie for long.

russ1, on Jun 12 2009, 01:20 PM, said:

To be honest you use your arms to pull the wheelie, it's just a sharp push. Once up in the wheelie position it's a case of small movements on the wheels with the hands to keep the contact point under your centre of gravity and you can also use your head for fine balance. A good practice is to try to hold the wheelie one handed (I have friends who can drink a pint of beer while holding a wheelie with one hand, an impressive party trick). There's really nil core muscles involved, the more you relax the easier it is. Getting into a deep back wheel balance position is tricky without core muscles (but possible) so I guess that most people using their core muscles when back wheel balancing aren't using their backrests on their chairs for support as if you have the ability to lean forward then I guess that it's the natural thing to do to counteract the feeling of going over backwards. Try not to do this if you're trying to learn as it will make it more difficult. Lean back and use the wheels and fine head movements. once you can do that way then start leaning forward to go into a deeper back wheel balance and start using your trunk muscles.

Very well explained. That sounds like you've actually observed me.

I guess I don't trust my hands enough to do their job.

A one-handed wheelie though... I'm afraid I won't be trying that one! Relaxing's hard enough when all the bits of me are in good form.

russ1, on Jun 12 2009, 01:20 PM, said:

When I said about grass I meant that moving over the grass was easier while holding a wheelie as opposed to pushing on four wheels and having the front castors digging in, i've never really noticed that maintaining a wheelie was easier on grass although the soft landing does make for much more confidence when practicing.

This could be a function of the incorrect/inefficient way I wheelie, but I find that if the surface is rough, it helps me maintain the position on the back wheels. This could also be psychological: I'm on the grass, so if I fall it's okay, and so I relax more... And yes, of course a wheelie's a better way to cross grass.

[adam_downunder]

When learning it is easier to balance on grass or plush carpet, anything soft, you're right. It softens the effects of you rocking back and forth trying to find that perfect spot to sit.

good luck with it. and once you've got it, you'll try one handed... its really not that hard....every now and again i try and settle in the spot and see if i can hold it no hands, and just use my head and shoulders to keep the spot right....needless to say, still working on it, but i have heard of guys that can do it.

[hurbshankin]

I can pull and hold a wheelie but I don't think I'd have much luck going down a hill yet. I've got no hand function, some grippy gloves from ADI make it possible for me to squeeze the rims with my deltoids. I've got 0 trunk control and use a high back chair. I do use my tippers, which are strong enough for me to wheelie back and rest on. I've been thinking about welding in some gussetts for re-enforcement.

Hurb

[ETW Grumpy]

I learned how to do them recently, and can pop up and hold it for a minute. I don't have anyone handy to spot me though. I can wheelie up onto curbs or into doorways, but can't wheelie back down. When I try to wheelie off a curb, my footplates hit causing a near faceplant (if not for my buddy catching me). What am I doing wrong?

[knightrider]

ETW Grumpy, on Jun 12 2009, 05:05 PM, said:

When I try to wheelie off a curb, my footplates hit causing a near faceplant (if not for my buddy catching me). What am I doing wrong?

It sounds like your not lifting the front wheels up enough off the ground, you can either go off with a little flick and roll off, which most people prefer but a safer way is to go off slow whilst holding a wheelie then once you've dropped off pull back on the rims so your back wheels are against the curb and you can hold it there safely without tipping back then just drop the front down, thats the way i tackle steps.

Since you can hold a wheelie for a minute, give that one a try, once you can do that it's the safest way. Be sure to have a spotter (buddy) with you when you try just incase.

[twisted_ophelia]

russ1, on Jun 12 2009, 05:32 AM, said:

Yeah - can't imagine having to use a chair without popping the odd wheelie everyday - and it's not about trunk control at all it's about balance. As T2 complete I have nil trunk control but can hold a wheelie to roll across gravel or roll down steep slopes quite happily - it's also often easier to hold a wheelie to roll across grass. It's not so much about the actual weight of the chair as the way it's set up and the centre of gravity. The tippier the chair the easier it is to pull a wheelie, once up however holding the wheelie is no different.

Really really useful skill to master but many people manage without, but makes going up and down small steps easily manageable which opens up many more areas to you.

It's definitely about trunk control AND balance. On my other chairs, all of which had backs that were higher by a good 5 inches, I could easily do wheelies and keep them up and going with no problem, moving forward, backwards, whatever. With my newest chair, the back comes to below my injury level and as I said, I can DO a wheelie, I can go fowards and sustain it for a bit but not for nearly as long as I could in all my other chairs. And it's not the chair either, I've played with the center of gravity, etc., but I guess I need that higher back to help me keep myself balanced because my abs won't really do it.

So, I'll rephrase it this way, you do NOT need trunk function if you have a higher back on your chair. And tinkering with your chair's center of gravity to help it get into wheelies will probably also help.

Edited by twisted_ophelia, 12 June 2009 - 04:36 PM.

[twisted_ophelia]

knightrider, on Jun 12 2009, 12:30 PM, said:

It sounds like your not lifting the front wheels up enough off the ground, you can either go off with a little flick and roll off, which most people prefer but a safer way is to go off slow whilst holding a wheelie then once you've dropped off pull back on the rims so your back wheels are against the curb and you can hold it there safely without tipping back then just drop the front down, thats the way i tackle steps.

Since you can hold a wheelie for a minute, give that one a try, once you can do that it's the safest way. Be sure to have a spotter (buddy) with you when you try just incase.

All this talk of tackling steps is making me want to try it again until I get it. I have tried numerous times over the years in all the different chairs I've had. I'm going to try your suggestion of sort of leaning on the stair behind me. I'm tired of getting out of my chair and dragging myself and it together up the stairs when there are no helpful piggy-backing friends around to haul me up a flight of stairs! I find when I do this in public (and I have done it tons of time while out and about alone), strangers get all freaked out and run to help me but I usually turn them down and just keep on climbing up (or down).

[knightrider]

Yeah your right, you do need a high back rest if you don't have trunk control, but most people who don't have abs, do have a high back anyway. So good point. Maybe you should see if you can get a higher one, i would if i were you, you gotta be comfortable in your ride.

[StillFingers]

Trunk control and grip...I wish, I'm not interested, C5 is high enough, anti-tippers rule