14 replies to this topic

[mcferguson]

I was wondering, since my spinal cord is severed, why didn't the neurosurgeon try to reconnect it? I am sure there is a medical reason, but I would think even a shot in the dark is better than nothing. I know the nerves wouldn't have reconnected in exactly the same way, but the body is very adaptive and I am sure the nerves could have been retrained.

[Ches]

Its the swelling and scar tissue that gets us.. Last thing doctors want to do is extra surgery.

[edlee]

An even bigger problem is infection. One is incredably suceptable to infection with any breach of the spinal fluid containing membrane,,, even injections can cause severe repercusions. You can imagine how much worse an operation on the spinal cord itself.

It would be an interesting direction,, I , too,, wonder why it hasn't been the subject of more testing,, animal and otherwise.
ed

[E-DOG]

mcferguson, on Nov 21 2009, 11:29 AM, said:

I know the nerves wouldn't have reconnected in exactly the same way, but the body is very adaptive and I am sure the nerves could have been retrained.

Well dang!
I've been going to the wrong doctor all along.
Fergie, would you mind fixing my SCI please?

[4tun8]

Having worked in an industrial atmosphere and the experience of all the electrics of a plant, it dawned upon me about 2 yrs post. Since we're basically talking electrical signals, as a temporary or permanent fix, could it be possible to make our different points of lesion a junction box. More or less the female side of a micro-processer in which you have inputs and outputs attached to the nerves. Then the chip which has basic motor functions programmed in with a learning curve built in. When first installed you think and your body follows, but as you repeat the motion the chip takes over at the thought of a task. Something kind of mechanical, cutting edge, until medicine can arrive on the scene. By the way, put myself on the trial list at Shepherds.
Mark

[mcferguson]

E-DOG, on Nov 21 2009, 07:39 PM, said:

mcferguson, on Nov 21 2009, 11:29 AM, said:

I know the nerves wouldn't have reconnected in exactly the same way, but the body is very adaptive and I am sure the nerves could have been retrained.

Well dang!
I've been going to the wrong doctor all along.
Fergie, would you mind fixing my SCI please?

ME!? E-Dog, I figured you be the first to jump at the chance to try this out, what with your vast surgical experience operating out of the trunk of your car! I was ready to fly out there and try this newfangled idea. I am sure I can find a few dollars in the couch to pay for it!

Ches, on Nov 21 2009, 01:38 PM, said:

Its the swelling and scar tissue that gets us.. Last thing doctors want to do is extra surgery.

I figured while he was in there installing my hardware, it wouldn't take too much effort to put the two pieces of my spinal cord together.

edlee, on Nov 21 2009, 07:09 PM, said:

An even bigger problem is infection. One is incredably suceptable to infection with any breach of the spinal fluid containing membrane,,, even injections can cause severe repercusions. You can imagine how much worse an operation on the spinal cord itself.

It would be an interesting direction,, I , too,, wonder why it hasn't been the subject of more testing,, animal and otherwise.
ed

Infection, yeah, thats a good reason. Don't want germs getting into the spinal fluid membrane. Didn't think of that. I'm sure E-Dog has figured out a way around that.

[topperf]

4tun8, on Nov 22 2009, 07:11 PM, said:

Having worked in an industrial atmosphere and the experience of all the electrics of a plant, it dawned upon me about 2 yrs post. Since we're basically talking electrical signals, as a temporary or permanent fix, could it be possible to make our different points of lesion a junction box. More or less the female side of a micro-processer in which you have inputs and outputs attached to the nerves. Then the chip which has basic motor functions programmed in with a learning curve built in. When first installed you think and your body follows, but as you repeat the motion the chip takes over at the thought of a task. Something kind of mechanical, cutting edge, until medicine can arrive on the scene. By the way, put myself on the trial list at Shepherds.
Mark

What trial is that? if I may ask - I am looking for something to participate in.. Something that might help restore me would be greatly appreciated ... ''trial list at Shepherds.'' A university?

[dangerousdave]

Yer mad,.... the lot of yea
A bit of cooked sand aint gonna make any differance. Scar tissue won't interface
You have to start thinkin about a bag of transmitting gel with the nerve poked in at one end and out the other .. simple
But as Startrek has shown .. the gel can get infected by nasty alien vireses.

This thought is not as mad as you may think. It's how cable TV operates.

[4tun8]

Top,
I went to the site and picked research. Upon that, it prompted me to volenteers for upcoming trials. It asks you to give some info on your your condition and retains that in data base 'til a trial you are canidate for. They will notify you when a suitable trial arrises. The trials have duration and physical requirements. Also you don't pay or get paid and must cover the expense of travel, lodging and meals as the trials are considered out-patient. Shepherd's has already aknowledged my status and am in their data base. Hope this answers what you wanted.
Mark

[topperf]

- Yes it did - thanks Mark.

[jules]

It is also important to remember that the Spinal cord itself is not the same as a regular nerve (antomically or physiologically), it is actually an extension of the brain hence part of the central nervous system

[Skrads]

The cells in the spinal cord are different to other cells, in that they do not heal and reproduce when damaged. Therefore, reconnecting the spinal cord through surgery is pointless as the spinal cord cells will not heal together.

[Kodie]

My doctor phrased it as "Like putting toothpaste back in the tube." Helluva way to explain it. Haha!

[adi chicago]

jules, on Nov 24 2009, 02:24 PM, said:

It is also important to remember that the Spinal cord itself is not the same as a regular nerve (antomically or physiologically), it is actually an extension of the brain hence part of the central nervous system

Very well said.

[Jax]

mcferguson, on Nov 21 2009, 01:29 PM, said:

I was wondering, since my spinal cord is severed, why didn't the neurosurgeon try to reconnect it? I am sure there is a medical reason, but I would think even a shot in the dark is better than nothing. I know the nerves wouldn't have reconnected in exactly the same way, but the body is very adaptive and I am sure the nerves could have been retrained.

Reason 1

edlee, on Nov 21 2009, 07:09 PM, said:

An even bigger problem is infection. One is incredably suceptable to infection with any breach of the spinal fluid containing membrane,,, even injections can cause severe repercusions. You can imagine how much worse an operation on the spinal cord itself.

It would be an interesting direction,, I , too,, wonder why it hasn't been the subject of more testing,, animal and otherwise.
ed

But this can be overcome. Just ask Dr. Carlos Lima, or any doctor associated with the RSCI.

Reason 2

bradgrove, on Dec 8 2009, 04:18 PM, said:

The cells in the spinal cord are different to other cells, in that they do not heal and reproduce when damaged. Therefore, reconnecting the spinal cord through surgery is pointless as the spinal cord cells will not heal together.

At least not on their own. This is usually due to the swelling and scar tissue also previously mentioned. However, with proper immediate post-injury care, and proper utilization of other procedures and/or techniques, the damage can be reduced, and some (though not all) of the damage could be reversed. Google "Chondroitinase," "Adult Autologous Repair Cells," "Olfactory Mucosa Autograft Transplantation." Articles on those things should get you started. There's lots of information tying them all together, and explaining them.



The biggest reason that spinal cord injury repair surgeries aren't done here is because the repair cells used to treat SCI can also be used to treat so many other things. Imagine if people had an option to have things like SCI (or any of the smaller things it causes) fixed with a 1-time surgery, rather than treated with numerous doctor visits, and lifetime drug purchases... Drug companies and all the politicians who have millions invested in them would lose billions of dollars right off the bat. That's why we don't have the surgical procedures and immediate-post-injury protocols that help with the effects of SCI.

Now, there isn't a whole lot as far as surgery that can be done immediately post-injury, but there are other things that can be done early-on. Systemic hypothermia for one. Chondroitinase injection for another.

Now, once the swelling has been reduced, and the spine has been set and hardware installed to keep it so, there are a couple things that could be done. Both have shown some positive results, even years post injury. I'm not talking walking around after taking a "magic pill," but there have been some small successes. The only problem is that you can't get them done in the US or the UK yet, because the bureaucrats don't want to lose all their money and campaign supporting pharma companies. Check out the FDA ruling on adult autologous repair cells (just google "FDA adult stem cell). After reading up on it, tell me that it doesn't sound at least suspicious, if not all-out crooked.

Also, check into the Stem Cell Blogger's site. There's tons of information there.