37 replies to this topic

[lavenderthistle]

For those of you who would like a more natural approach to management of issues, here are some ideas;

UTI's

Cranberry extract, Garlic oil capsules, Ginger, Echinacea, Gingko all work together to target microbes and e-coli then strengthen the immune system. Saw Palmetto helps to reduce residual urine in the bladder.
Cystex makes many preparations for UTI health or you could try the above herbals in conjunction with one another

Digestion aids

Ginger or herbal bitters such as Blessed Thistle, Barberry Bark, Dandelion Root etc. Peppermint teas or enteric coated tablets (tablets are released in the intestine so they could sting on exit), or Chamomile tea.

Muscle spasms

Valerian Root (works on the same receptors as valium only slightly less effective and wholly non addictive so take it more often) Melatonin, Kava, Gingko, Magnesium oil applied topically (internal magnesium can have a laxative effect)

Nerve pain

Gingko, Evening Primrose Oil (internally)

Inflammation

Ginger, Bromelain (in pineapple also) Arnica tablets, Arnica tea

Circulation

Gingko, Ginger, Bilberry

Wounds

St. John's Wort Oil, Honey

Sore muscles

Horse Chestnut gel, Arnica gel , also the inflammation suggestions

Laxatives

Psyllium seeds, Magnesium

When taking herbals mention them to your doctor. If you are interested in using herbals but are unsure check with a naturopath or an herbalist or invest in a good book. Checking online will give you the dosages you need or PM me for more info. I'm actually using a book written by an N.D and am not pulling this info out of the air. With any herbal preparation or individual herb you will need to look for high quality preferably AHPA, or NNFA products…if you use homeopathic preparations look for HPUS. B vitamins especially B6/9/12 are very important for nerve impulse transmission a good B vitamin is a must. B should preferably be sub lingual or liquid. I take EMTAL by Nature's choice a combination of B's C/D/E Calcium, Magnesium (not sub lingual). I add in a liquid with B9 (folic acid) . B's leave in urine so you can't really have a build up.

Isobar recommends the following; (i had permission for this)

Kama Sutra herbal healing blend massage oil, Herbal Heat (both containing Emu Oil) Olbas Herbal Bath, salon pas pain patches, a good massager which also stretches the muscle, a moist heat heating pad, compression sleeves relieve spasms and increase circulation. TENS unit will also help chronic pain.

Country Life makes a supplement for muscle spasms Cal-Mag-Potassium, Oatstraw is also useful for spasms.



Stillfingers recommends; (i lifted this from another post)

Grapeseed extract ROEX/PC95 and Ultimate Calcium Mineral formula from ROEX



I hope some of you find this helpful and continue to add your own herbal remedies. If you don't or can't take herbals at least ask your doctor about adding in Milk Thistle to protect your liver from many medications. If you need some links please let me know and I will do my best to find one. I didn't want to make this too long and info-y, especially if no one is interested in it!

Lav

Edited by lavenderthistle, 26 July 2011 - 03:00 AM.

[greybeard]

It fascinates me that some people are prepared to shun conventional medical remedies -- the usual argument being that because they contain chemicals they are harmful to the human body -- but are happy to ingest extracts from plants etc., often from dubious sources, in the belief that they are less likely to cause harm. They seem to overlook the fact that these plant extracts are themselves composed of chemicals, just as is every other substance on this planet.

I do not suggest that some herbal remedies are any less effective at treating particular symptoms. They may have been used beneficially since the dawn of time, but they have not been subjected to the same rigorous testing and approval process as conventional medicines. Proof of their safety, especially when mixed with other herbal remedies or conventional medicines is, at best anecdotal, and at worst downright dangerous.

Faith in many ancient remedies is often based purely on the shape or appearance of a plant etc. It used to be thought that a mixture of crushed up earth worms and red wine cured bruises. It is doubtful that many would believe that still to be true. Some "naturally" occurring chemicals, like salicylic acid (aspirin) which is extracted from willow bark, have proved to be effective and reasonably safe. There are many others.

To suggest that the average doctor is qualified to advise on taking herbal remedies is not helpful. Most will have had little or no training at all in the subject. Anyone who is unsure should consult a pharmacist rather than a doctor. Don't be surprised if the advice is not what you want to hear.

I know which remedies I would rather put my faith in despite my disgust at the obscene profiteering by the chemical companies. But they at least have had to produce substances to a certain quality and effectiveness. The same cannot be said of some suppliers of "natural" remedies who are akin to snake oil salesmen in that they make their not insubstantial profits from the gullible. Take care.

Edited by greybeard, 26 July 2011 - 09:23 AM.

[MTB John]

It's the LONG list of side effects I have issue with..

Don't get me wrong I'm on meds, but would dearly love to be off them.

And if doping up on vitamins can help, and the only side effect is glow in the dark urine then I'll give it a shot..

[mcwriter]

I have to agree with greybeard's reasoning here. I am not discounting the benefits of what lavenderthistle offers in information, however the utmost caution should be used.

The fact that herbal remedies are unregulated and are available in many forms as readily available as buying a tomato, consider that even tomatoes are available in different levels of quality and nutritional value. Regular tomatoes grown in the field with pesticides, etc., versus organic tomatoes, versus, hot house tomatoes. Herbal remedies also have a variety of preparation methods that can effect their potency, whether there are any additives of any kind, the conditions they were grown in, etc.

While this is true of anything, at least medically approved remedies have undergone controlled processes and testing so that one can be aware of the possible side effects, it's drug interactions and specific dosage management. Even with every new medication your doctor wants to try on you, you want to get as much information as possible about it, so that you can weigh the benefits with the possible side effects. You can ask about alternatives as well. The important thing is that as your doctor is trying to manage your health, he needs to be aware of anything you do that might affect what he is prescribing.

When introducing an herbal remedy into your system, you need to be as informed as possible. What works well for one may not work for another or could even be detrimental according to your own body chemistry and other medication or supplements you take. If your own doctor is not familiar with what you think you want to try, do also seek out pharmacist who is schooled in the chemical reactions and interactions of substances.

Even your diet can affect how any of these (medically approved or not) work in your system. A friend says, "This works for me", but no one is exactly the same. Even prescriptions can be hit or miss, but at least with them there are specific guidelines for management and specific testing and courses of action that can be taken to get your individual body chemistry operating as it should if something does not work for you or if something goes awry.

Please get professional advice first.

Edited by mcwriter, 26 July 2011 - 02:17 PM.

[mcwriter]

 MTB John, on 26 July 2011 - 01:54 PM, said:

It's the LONG list of side effects I have issue with..

Don't get me wrong I'm on meds, but would dearly love to be off them.

And if doping up on vitamins can help, and the only side effect is glow in the dark urine then I'll give it a shot..

Did you know that there are some vitamins that can get toxic in your system if taken in too high of quantities? While other vitamins don't do that and your body automatically rids itself of the excess?

Edited by mcwriter, 26 July 2011 - 02:21 PM.

[MTB John]

 mcwriter, on 26 July 2011 - 02:20 PM, said:

 MTB John, on 26 July 2011 - 01:54 PM, said:

It's the LONG list of side effects I have issue with..

Don't get me wrong I'm on meds, but would dearly love to be off them.

And if doping up on vitamins can help, and the only side effect is glow in the dark urine then I'll give it a shot..

Did you know that there are some vitamins that can get toxic in your system if taken in too high of quantities? While other vitamins don't do that and your body automatically rids itself of the excess?

Ok perhaps doping was the wrong term..
I did yes, and I do not take anything, herbal or pharmaceutical without first researching it..

[mcwriter]

 MTB John, on 26 July 2011 - 02:31 PM, said:

 mcwriter, on 26 July 2011 - 02:20 PM, said:

 MTB John, on 26 July 2011 - 01:54 PM, said:

It's the LONG list of side effects I have issue with..

Don't get me wrong I'm on meds, but would dearly love to be off them.

And if doping up on vitamins can help, and the only side effect is glow in the dark urine then I'll give it a shot..

Did you know that there are some vitamins that can get toxic in your system if taken in too high of quantities? While other vitamins don't do that and your body automatically rids itself of the excess?

Ok perhaps doping was the wrong term..
I did yes, and I do not take anything, herbal or pharmaceutical without first researching it..

Good. I really worry about when people try things without researching.

I'm glad I don't have to worry about you. Alas, I am a worrier

[lavenderthistle]

An N.D. is a naturopathic physician. They are real doctors and see patients. They are general practitioners. If you will kindly note...I did state to check with a naturopath, meaning naturopathic physician, or an herbalist. The herbalists I was referring to was not a psycho in an alley with a twitch. There are trained herbalists.

I'm not planning to go to anyone's home and giggle madly whilst flushing pills. I do still have to take a few prescriptions, but only at night. I'm not anti prescriptions. I started this thread not to argue, but to share that there are other ways.

I also hope you note that I wrote in bold to tell your gp.

My gp happens to support this.

Also I don't claim this will heal you, so it isn't really snake oil.

Thanks for your helpful input.

[mcwriter]

Now that that is all out of the way, I hope we can continue this informative thread.

I for one am curious to know about what forms of these herbs are better because I have shopped both in regular markets that display some of these near the vitamin section and also at different kinds of healthfood type stores.

Some things I have read say that some herbs are best when infused into a tea for instance and I am actually wondering what you think about this versus the capsule version?

isobar is also very knowledgeable about herbs and also offers info about diet. Maybe there can be a meeting of the minds here.

I am really interested though about the different forms some of these herbs come in and what is the better way to buy.

I am especially interested in things that boost your immune system.

Edited by mcwriter, 26 July 2011 - 03:40 PM.

[HiltonP]

Actually I'd sooner trust a "psycho in an alley" than my local doctor.
The reason I'm in a bloody chair is because of a GP!

[StillFingers]

I've always found it interesting that when someone writes about the benefits (supposed) of supplements they are immediately met with the old "SNAKE OIL SALESMAN" line of crap. The Chinese, Indians, etc. have been practicing herbalists for much longer than any pharmaceutical company has been in existence and their main goal is relief...not money; my faith in the pill industry to "DO THE RIGHT THING" is wanting at best and given our governments are intertwined with said companies, I have even less faith. Ten thousand plus years of experience vs. a few hundred...scratches head...neither god nor science are my be-all-to-end-all.

Not being an idiot, I tirelessly research any supplement put in this body before it even touches my lips. Having type 2 diabetes, an ulcer and anemia on occasion, I always consult my GP first, make damn sure there are no known conflicts with the meds I take and I ease into anything new. Also, I'm very cautious of the exotic stuff, stay away from it, I like living tooooo much to do otherwise!

Be very cautious with anything you put into your body! I could write a book regarding my supplement, raw/whole foods and meditation explorations, going it the natural way, as I have (since SCI) not taken spasm or pain meds on any regular basis...but it's only my way; not for everyone to try. Perhaps I'm a fool for dealing with my new body in this way, for there is daily pain/shaking, I'm a stuborn, greedy f*@k and just want to live life on my terms...as long as I can!

I'm also weak, love pepperoni pizza, bacon, hamburgers n hot dogs (Nathans), dark chocolate, most wines and Tequila...and as much sunshine as I can get...not usually at the same time tho!

Jerry

Edited by StillFingers, 26 July 2011 - 05:34 PM.

[Smileyblue]

I think there's a time and place for everything..

When meds dont work,I take herbal remedies, and vice versa.. I also research anything I have to take, be it meds OR herbs.. You HAVE to know what you are putting into your body..

I think this is a great thread! Very helpful indeed!

[greybeard]

 StillFingers, on 26 July 2011 - 05:03 PM, said:

I've always found it interesting that when someone writes about the benefits (supposed) of supplements they are immediately met with the old "SNAKE OIL SALESMAN" line of crap.

Did you overlook this word, Jerry?

Quote

The same cannot be said of some suppliers of "natural" remedies who are akin to snake oil salesmen in that they make their not insubstantial profits from the gullible. Take care.

.......And that sure as hell ain't always crap, my friend!!

[ClaraTaylor]

 StillFingers, on 26 July 2011 - 05:03 PM, said:

Be very cautious with anything you put into your body!
Jerry

You know I distinctly remember the vicar saying something like that when he came to give us the birds and bees talk.

[brockit79]

thanks Lav,

I do love herbals. I used to use certain herbal remedies before my accident and still use some so it is helpful to have suggestions of things to try.

Whilst as I know that herbals are chemicals at the end of the day, I have also found it helpful to have a reminder that I need to check possible contraindications.

:-D and with a sip of chamomile (necessa)tea, I think about going to sleep.

Broc

[lavenderthistle]

The backbone of the immunotherapy is Echinacea purpurea (expressed juice) Eleuthero (Siberian Ginseng) and Garlic supplemented with a good quality multi vitamin. You would add in different herbs based on what part of the immune system you're concerned with...ie...colds and flu, chronic fatigue, even using herbs to support the body during other treatments.

If you are genuinely interested in herbals but leery of their use...many schools (yes accredited ones) have websites with links to find practitioners and even more links for publications.

http://www.bastyr.edu/public/

http://www.scnm.edu/...athy-today.html

Ideally the best place to purchase said herbs, minerals and a good multi vitamin is with a local specialty health food store. Meet the owner, they will likely be very knowledgeable and quite possibly be licensed or a trained herbalist. The best places will also offer money back guarantees. The best method to use or purchase them in really varies based on what you plan to treat. Kind of like do you prefer to smoke, dip or chew...it's all tobacco but how does it best affect you? No, I am not advocating smoking cigarettes I gave those up years ago.

Please research anything you plan to buy. I have many people whose opinion I rely on, but at the end of the day, it all falls to me and what I decide is best for my body. This is also based on trial and error... example...kava kava gives me migraines, I don't take it. Morphine also gives me migraines I don't take it either. It's my responsibility and yours to know through trial and error what works or doesn't.

Some people respond well to apitherapy, but I haven't tried it. I do plan to try accupunture...I would say I'll keep you posted but......as I now have a headache I will take my feverfew in my teepee while mooning the mole people and hope my sci magically clears up...I would dance to the tree people and the rock fairies but my coordination isn't what it used to be.

Honestly this is just one way to approach it...I've said in SEVERAL of my "flaky' posts that this works for ME. I have been using herbals for years to treat bone and nerve pain from previous unfortunate incidents. I'm not offended that you think I'm an idiot. I just hope that some people don't see the negative comments and close their minds to the possibilities.

That said, I respect you all and your opinions

Edited by lavenderthistle, 27 July 2011 - 02:54 AM.

[MTB John]

 ClaraTaylor, on 26 July 2011 - 09:42 PM, said:

 StillFingers, on 26 July 2011 - 05:03 PM, said:

Be very cautious with anything you put into your body!
Jerry

You know I distinctly remember the vicar saying something like that when he came to give us the birds and bees talk.

A bit delicate was he???

[isobar]

A lot of medicine prescribed to people have natural elements as part of their components your health situation plays a major factor in what you can or cannot try. All the supplements i 've used and stated here where helpful to me in a big way. Some of you say snake oil but have you tried any of them ? Doctors are romanced by pharmaceutical companies all the time. For instance papaya aids in digestion and its a fruit . Cascarsagrada aids in constipation , will remove plaque from colon , kills flow smelling bowel moments and results in good evacuations ... stay home when you take it.

Edited by isobar, 27 July 2011 - 08:59 PM.

[Tatiana]

I find this post interesting...thankyou LV for sharing with us.

I dont really know enough about natural remedies to comment on such matters but i am open minded and curious to know more.

I dont discount anything until i can say i have a good understanding of it and can then make an informed decision on wether,in this case,natural remedies would be something i would try.

My doctor also put me in my situation so i have less trust in the medic profession. I no longer presume that they will make the right decisions for me......knowledge is power!

[Slowlegs]

For me the jury is out on what does and doesn't work in the way of natural treatments, then again the regular ones aren't the best either. It seems I have tried most of them on your list LT and while they definitely give relief, none have cured me, as yet.

Currently I am still getting multi resistant infections regularly, I have always had infections since my injury but they are made more resistant by the frequent use of antibiotics. My doctors used to just prescribe antibiotics for all my infections but gradually the infections got more and more resistant, something they don't seem to do with naturals.

Currently I use a mix of both, the naturals help keep the bugs at a manageable level and the antibiotics I use as a last resort, my weapons of mass destruction.

Both have their place in medicine but overuse or abuse of both can give terrible side effects.

Edited by Slowlegs, 29 July 2011 - 01:54 AM.

[isobar]

If you have high blood pressure a smoothie made with fruits/ greens containing calcium , potassium and magnesium will help lower your blood pressure.

Diabetics can use Agave Nectar as a sweetener it releases in your blood stream very slowly.


Sweet potatoes are better for diabetics than white potatoes.



I wrote a thread on the top ten foods for your skin look in the pressure sore or general issues headings.

Edited by isobar, 31 July 2011 - 10:56 AM.

[Simba]

This is a great thread Lav and some interesting input from isobar - thanks to you both.

Using natural compounds is often much better for your body but must be done in consultation with your doctor and a naturopathic doctor depending on what you are seeking treatment for (as in conditions).

The rate of absorption & the ability to utilise the chemical when it's a naturally occuring compund is much higher and the side effects from natural therapy are usually much lower in general. They can also be used in combination with medication as long as you check that they do not react together. Some natural therapy can even increase the effectiveness of your medication. It all must be carefully checked out with the appropriate doctors but it is well worth looking into and finding out what supplements or alternative tratments are available.

Natural therapy has existed for centuries prior to medication even existing in it's highly synthesized form. It is also interesting to note that the drug companies are the highest profit businesses in the world - many exceedingly wealthy people you will find have large shares in this industry and it could be said that most of what is on the drug market is pedalled merely to turn a profit in todays world.

I am certainly not suggesting they are useless medication has it's place and proper use for sure, I wouldn't discourage people from keeping their options open though and looking into more natural ways (if they exist for their medical conditions) for treatment.

[lavenderthistle]

Lately I've had a lot more burning nerve pain. I've been working with B vitamins. Since injury I've had a lot of issues with visceral pain. I have to add things slowly to make sure my system can handle it.
That said, this week it weekend I plan to try adding in the evening primrose oil and ginkgo.

Smileyblue, (up there^^^^) started a thread on her experience with D-Mannose (sp?) You may want to check it out, as others have shared their experiences too.

I also forgot.....Woodlock oil works for some people with general muscle pain, also tiger balm. Beware you could smell like the local Dojo.

[ems]

Beetroot lowers your blood pressure

[Smileyblue]

 lavenderthistle, on 02 August 2011 - 12:32 PM, said:

Smileyblue, (up there^^^^) started a thread on her experience with D-Mannose (sp?) You may want to check it out, as others have shared their experiences too.

I'm clear of infection for the first time in months! I attribute it to the D-Mannose, the Vetericyn flushes, the cranberry, and drinking 6 to 8 litres a day to flush the kidneys! These things did what my urologist, the hospital, and antibiotics couldn't.. I have to add here though, that D-Mannose only works for ecoli which makes up around 80-90% of all bladder infections.. ;-)

Edited by Smileyblue, 11 August 2011 - 10:00 PM.

[greybeard]

 Slowlegs, on 29 July 2011 - 01:53 AM, said:

For me the jury is out on what does and doesn't work in the way of natural treatments, then again the regular ones aren't the best either. It seems I have tried most of them on your list LT and while they definitely give relief, none have cured me, as yet.

Currently I am still getting multi resistant infections regularly, I have always had infections since my injury but they are made more resistant by the frequent use of antibiotics. My doctors used to just prescribe antibiotics for all my infections but gradually the infections got more and more resistant, something they don't seem to do with naturals.

Currently I use a mix of both, the naturals help keep the bugs at a manageable level and the antibiotics I use as a last resort, my weapons of mass destruction.

Both have their place in medicine but overuse or abuse of both can give terrible side effects.

There is a world of difference between taking advice on remedies from people from this forum who have found them to be helpful, as opposed to raiding the health-food shop for anything that the salesperson might recommend.

There is little reason not to try a "natural remedy" (*) that is recommended by a person you trust, and who you know has had the same symptoms as you. However, it is safer to discuss the issue with your GP first to rule out unwanted interaction with prescribed medicines.

(*) - I use that term as it has been widely used in this thread, but repeat that all "natural remedies", however many generations they may have been used for, are simply combinations of chemicals that happen to occur in nature. That does not necessarily mean that they are any more efficacious than their synthetic counterparts. The reverse could well be true if the naturally occurring substances also includes harmful impurities that you might not know about.

[pinkcloud]

i agree with both sides

Greybeard, anyone who hates meds and can cope with just natural stuff, good on them i say. Afterall people in Tailand dont have medicines like us and live to a ripe old age..mind you then again they live literally in rubbish tips too ( i have a friend from there who does charity work for them) and army people have operations in tents rather than clean theatres...so maybe its more an individual thing? Its hard..herbal salesmen...drug company reps...who to trust? Not any really...we just take meds to help us kill the pain..anything really..except i wouldnt resort to street drugs....dirty hands that have passed them on and on...uurrhh shudder...just as lethel as chemically sprayed tomatoes,

Lav i have heard time and time again that dope/weed is great for nerve pain..its a herb/natural..yet they dont sell this for some of the side effects..yet from all i have read..they are less harmful than the pharmacuitcal ones.....it cant be just it makes us off our head....big doses of certain meds do this and more. If it works for you, great..lovely to see you letting people know the alternatives..me good friend has ms and relies on these.....then again she has a neurologist in the family so can check this out...still sometimes she takes western medicine.....anything that helps pain is great, all stuff we take is 'buy now pay later'...anyway.

i think a good mixture of western and good old fashioned herbs etc works...after all me spinal consultant recommends senna...urologist cranberry capsules
....

[MTB John]

 pinkcloud, on 12 August 2011 - 11:34 AM, said:

i agree with both sides

Greybeard, anyone who hates meds and can cope with just natural stuff, good on them i say. Afterall people in Tailand dont have medicines like us and live to a ripe old age..mind you then again they live literally in rubbish tips too ( i have a friend from there who does charity work for them)

Hay Miss PC,
I think your friend likes to embellish things somewhat. They have some world class hospitals overhere, not just in terms of doctors but service too. I stayed in one for a week or so - had my own room, dvd, cable, microwave and when you need something there is an intercom system conected to the nurses station. Just press the button and tell them what you need.
Also alot of generic drugs are made here and as for the army, well, mobile hospitals are hardly a new concept.

That's my bit of thread jacking for the day. Now where did I leave that bottle of cobra blood??

[lavenderthistle]

MTBJohn.....cobra blood was left in the teepee with the fairies.

GB....I actually included the circulation info for you because of a post you had about it.

PC .....I truly believe the less than legal herb is THE best thing for pain.

I'm not having luck with the magnesium oil for spasms, it didn't mix well with the acid bath nerve pain I'm having, since it makes my skin tingle.... I'm sticking with my tried and true valerian root and melatonin mix.

Thanks for all the input, I love hearing what works. It reminds me to revisit remedies I've used but forgotten....Greybeard, thanks for reminding people to research things first

Headaches...Migraines.....Feverfew. It works for me.

[dom]

 mcwriter, on 26 July 2011 - 02:20 PM, said:

 MTB John, on 26 July 2011 - 01:54 PM, said:

It's the LONG list of side effects I have issue with..

Don't get me wrong I'm on meds, but would dearly love to be off them.

And if doping up on vitamins can help, and the only side effect is glow in the dark urine then I'll give it a shot..

Did you know that there are some vitamins that can get toxic in your system if taken in too high of quantities? While other vitamins don't do that and your body automatically rids itself of the excess?

Yea thats why i would never eat a polar bears liver http://animals.howst...-bear-liver.htm

 MTB John, on 27 July 2011 - 02:49 AM, said:

 ClaraTaylor, on 26 July 2011 - 09:42 PM, said:

 StillFingers, on 26 July 2011 - 05:03 PM, said:

Be very cautious with anything you put into your body!
Jerry

You know I distinctly remember the vicar saying something like that when he came to give us the birds and bees talk.

A bit delicate was he???

Cup of tea vicar?