61 replies to this topic

[Scarlet1975]

I'm not a freak looking for kicks in any way. This is a geniune enquiry.
I'm a fully AB person.
I have recently completed a book called Me Without You by Jojo Moyes (google it). Essentially it is the story of a girl (Lou Clark - I felt I understood her, she's a bit dippy!) who is hired (without any experience) to be the companion of a once fit and virile young man who before an acciden,t led a very big life. He was a high flyer who worked in the City, adrenalin junkie, good looking, had a gorgeous girlfriend, led the big life in London, etc. Been in the wrong place at the wrong time left him a quadriplegic.

At first I thought, ugh, chick-lit. But no, it is not a conventional story and they don't go sailing off into the sunset and live happily ever after.

My point I'm trying to make is that I always thought I was open minded, but this book only highlighted my own prejudices and in a way embarressed me! I always thought it was very black and white, in fact, it is a complex, delicate world in which non-abled bodied find themselves in. I've never been cruel or unkind (simply not in my nature), but as said, the point I'm trying to make is that I realised (and hopefully other AB readers of this book) realised, that this is a complex and not so black-and-white as previously thougth.

Saying that, the book had some real laugh out moments and one-liners (I identified with Will Traynor's sarcastic sense of humour). There is a moment in the book, where the main protaganist (Will Traynor) quips to Lou's boyfriend ''she gives great bed baths''. I chuckled out loud. It was at that moment I stopped looking at him as a quadriplegic and just as someone who was really sharp, witty and funny and really knew how to delivery an excellant one liner very timeously.
I'll be honest, the book ends with the main character Will going to Dignatas in Switzerland - his choice, his choice that he felt it was the only thing he had control of. As said, I always thought of myself as open-minded and used to think, well, if that is want someone really wants, then they should be allowed to do as they want. But its not as simple as that, this book showed me that. This book really helped me open my eyes about a topic which I never really thought (I don't mean just Dignatas, I mean quadriplegics and paraplegics and how we perceive as ''limited'' and less of a human being), I also mean, what life is for non-AB people.

I think what really got me about these ''characters'' is that they geniunely did fall in love. Not that Hollywood cr**, but the book makes the reader think, well, what is life worth living for? It is about the friendship between these two, how two complete opposite characters were the only two in the world that could actually understand each other that even despite, on paper, they shouldn't, they do and did. It made me sad when Will said to Lou (when she told him she loved him and she didn't care about the chair), he said ''Its not enough. I can't be the man I want to be with you''. He didn't want pity, he wanted to be who he was before. This really hurt Lou because she thought the fact she told him she loved him, it would be enough. I thought it was incredibly brave and frankly, selfless, that he ''rejected'' her. He didn't reject her because he didn't want her. He said no, because he couldn't be himself, he felt he couldn't be himself.

I wouldn't mind chatting with anybody who is/was in the similiar position as the main character as Will Traynor - hopefully you are leading a full life, I don't know, this will be an educational process for and to be honest, occassionally I'll probably say something highly inappropriate or an un-PC one liner, but that is my nature, I would also try to be sensitive.

This is not for kicks, this is not for some freakshow, but just a geniune message from an AB wanting to understand, wanting to communicate with somone, just communicate and understand. I can't get these characters out of my head - yes, I'm aware that there is a massive differance between characters in a book and reality - I'm not stupid.

Honestly, I am geniunely interested, just trying to understand and educate myself. I hope to hear from someone soon

scarletfever1975@hotmail.com

[wheeliebear75]

I'm not familiar with the book you're talking about.

I do know that it takes people different amounts of time not just to adjust but to truly "LIVE".....for ME it was about 5yrs, I've had bouts of depression that have made death seem like "Not a bad idea" though I haven't done anything to "check out" prematurly. Just as a personal beliefe.....I think with Switzerland having these euthenasia laws it makes many Europeans much more inclined to do so than if they did have such a readily available option. The U.S. has had euthenasia come up on ballots before; none of the 50 U.S. states to my knowledge actually passed them which is why "Dr. Death" (Dr. Cavorkian.....I'm probably spelling it wrong but just Google it) was brought into court AND had to serve jail-time for I think they found him guilty of "justifiable homicide" & wasn't given a long prison term. But under Switzerland's rules just about anyone can just fill out some paperwork & take the concockshun of pills & without the blood. But if this is a book based on the true life of someone than somebody let them down by not showing/telling them about the fact that there is such a thing as sex post SCI even for the fellas with a higher up injury.

Read the posts on this forum & you'll get a good picture.....but I'm not saying you're "wrong" for asking.....I personally would MUCH RATHER members of the AB comunity ask rather than just ASS-U-ME!

[Scarlet1975]

Thanks for responding and for not ASS_U-ME_ing that I was taking the mickey.
Book is a work of fiction, I think the author did her homework and tackled a subject that can be very divisive (much like abortion I suppose). There were some referances to actual occurences, but the whole ''names changed to protect identities, blah, blah'', etc.

I think for this particular character in the book, it was more about just not been able to have sex with someone he fell in love with (or felt he couldn't). He felt he couldn't be who he was before, which was the adrenaline junkie (which is why his companion tried to organise outings and holidays to show, see you can still bungee jump, swimming with dolphines or whatever, etc, it just takes a bit more planning.

It is interesting that when the character was doing her homework on SCI, she joined a forum much like this and she asked people what they missed the most and the resounding answer was sex. Anyway, I suppose, one has to read the book to find out when she was told this and many of the more unsavoury responses - it was funny.

I think I may have a long way to go to understanding this quadriplegic/paraplegic issue (pushing the whole Dignatas issue aside for the moment) and also to realise that sometimes you guys simply don't want or need our help and still capable of doing things for yourselves? But I think it is in our AB nature (justified or not) and rather awkwardly that we ASSUME you need help on everything?

What does L2 Incomplete mean?

[mcferguson]

What does L2 Incomplete mean?

Spinal cord injuries are referenced by there location along the spinal column, and it is not always cut-and-dried. "L" refers to the lumbar section of the spinal column, which is at the base, "T" refers to the thorasic section, which is in the middle, and "C" refers to the cervic section, which is at the top. The number refers to the vertebra within each section. "Incomplete" refers to the severity of the injury. In an incomplete injury, there are still some nerve signals that can pass through the injury site. In a complete injury, no nerve signals pass through the injury site.

There is a more detailed explanation on the main page of apparelyzed.com. Thanks for stopping by and asking questions.

[Tetracyclone]

What does L2 Incomplete mean?

go here:
http://www.apparelyzed.com/support/functionality/c1-c3.html

[Spinner]

I couldn't find any information on the book on either google or amazon. I am not quite sure what kind of information you are looking for, but I will respond as the able bodied spouse; my husband is quadriplegic. Personally, I see the man before I see his disability and most of the time I tend to forget he about the chair. I have been known to tell him to move his van out of the handicapped spot before getting a ticket (causing him to look at me like I have two heads).

My husband was quite the daredevil before his accident. It was taking huge risks in hopes of an payoff in adrenaline that landed him the chair to begin with. He has definitely had to readjust to life on wheels, but I would say that his life is just as big now - just in different ways. He can't be the man he was with me or with anyone else, but he can be the man he is and that man is pretty freaking awesome. We do have an active and fulfilling sex life - it just looks different then a conventional sex life.

The thing that always tends to irritate me about book such as the one you are discussing is the main character's inevitable "selfless" choice to leave his lover "for their own good." WTF? Really that is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. To have the love of my life, my soul mate, the man I have waited for for 40 years do me a favor and leave? Again, WTF? The "selfless" thing to do is to stay with the one you love who loves you back and work through all the challenges that any relationships brings.

Edited by Spinner, 19 June 2012 - 04:44 PM.

[qbounce]

Try searching: "Me Before You," Jojo Moyes.

[The Black Sheep]

Has the book been published yet? I did a google search and didn't come up with anything. It sounds like you're requesting insight after the book's already been published. That's fine, I'm just curious. One other thing to consider is that most people who are going to potentially read this have absolutely no connection to someone with a spinal cord injury. Look at Jeffery Deaver's main protagonist Lincoln Rhymes. (The movie the Bone Collector) Jeffery Deaver isn't paralyzed and he's hugely successful with the series.

I'm a T5, mid-back, so I don't really have a voice for the quads. There are some awesome dudes and dudettes here in that position, and you'll get a mixed bag of life experiences. Unfortunately, I think you may have come too late to meet one of the best men ever, as Scribbs recently passed.

I'm also writing a book (queue the need to self attention) and my main antagonist is a quad. Cause quads can be power hungry munches just like the rest. It doesn't have anything to do with his paralysis, but whatever. He's an awesome bad guy.

[wheeliebear75]

In MY case the "incomplete" means I have enough signal getting through that I have some sensation (not always such a "good" thing) of my legs, to allow me to use forearm crutches for very short distances, & that I have just enough sensation/function of bladder & bowels that although it's far from "normal" I don't HAVE TO use a catheter to release urine.....and we'll just leave THAT subject at that. But my legs have really lousy circulation so I get colder quicker than do my AB friends, & I more often than not have a pins & needles sensation in my buttocks, backs of my legs, & on the bottoms of my feet. And I have issues with once I'm in a standing or laying STRAIT......THAT position makes my legs go numb-ER.....so the longer I try walking the more it's like walking on stilts, & the more leg spasms I have which makes them more & more unsteady.....so I use a wheelchair for most things & use my crutches for really SHORT distances so that I'm still "using them" & not letting them atrophy completely although the muscles from about belly button (that's about where L2 is) down are sorta jello-ish or floppy.

Edited by wheeliebear75, 19 June 2012 - 09:43 PM.

[julibugs]

The book is called "Me Before You" Jojo Moyes and is available on Kindle, I have read it and it irritated me because of the petty little inaccuracies relating to the condition of the quadraplegic in the book. Bowels were only mentioned is a disconected and distant way and yet we all know that they are a huge issue not just for us but for anyone involved in caring for us. Bladder function got the same treatment, the carer was required to "change his tubes" but no mention was ever made of emptying a bag of urine! even when out on day trips. For me the book was just another example of AB people getting it so very very wrong. This young man, who was fortunate enough to be very rich and had the benefit of the best private health care money could buy had managed to come out of hospital to a specially adapted facility tacked onto the family pile without a single piece of adaptive technology - so of course it is left to the heroine to discover a computer that her employer can use and then she doesn't think to tell him about the wonderful forum she has found and allow him the benefit of all that support and friendship. Totally unbelieivable story if you have an SCI, a bit of tittilating chic lit if you don't.

Would it have been so difficult for the author to join this forum, contact an SCI rehabilitation centre or just find a quad willing to talk to her and give her a real insight into living with an SCI of that nature?

Rant over.................... I think it's great for AB people to learn more about SCI's but reading this particular book is not the way to do it.

just as an amusing aside it is a bit ironic that I probably read most of this book while attached to my peristeen system.

Edited by julibugs, 19 June 2012 - 11:51 PM.

[The Black Sheep]

I remember a while back when MC Writer was writing a book about a young woman who was paralyzed and she actually asked what we felt would be good to include. One of the things was the lack of detail with catheters and pooping. I know that's a huge part of our lives, but I think this book was written for a romantic audience, or at least that's what I picked up on the description by Amazon.

If people want to learn about SCI, and we tend to get them here, they're usually flagged as devos here on the site, especially if they inquire about things in the romance department or private parts. I'm not defending the topic or how it was handled, but I think for the majority of people aren't amused (especially romantically) by poop systems. It's not really an educational story, but it does bring a compassionate opinion of someone with paralysis. It'd be different if it were a documentary.

The reviews for the book were really fantastic so there's gotta be some sort of magical romance or twitterpating going on.

[Scarlet1975]

Hi all

Thanks for all the feedback.

My curiousity comes from a good place and I certainly don’t want my original posting to come off as I am ‘’romanticising’’ after reading the book. As I don’t know much about the lifestyles of non-abled individuals, I can’t say anything about the details of peeing, the pooping and the sex life, etc, that some of you refer to, which is obviously a big issue with regards to what we as AB persons take for granted.
Thanks for the details…uhm…I think!

Perhaps more mention could have been made of the such daily functions, catheters, etc, could have been done by the author, I don’t know.

Spinner
Point duly noted about how you think it was not selfless and rather a WTF moment. Wheelchair or not, soulmate is a soulmate.

The Black Sheep
I have watched The Bone Collector years ago, but now I’m think I need to watch it again, maybe for just more insight as you say? Thx! Perhaps Deaver did more research on the subject prior to tackling it? I don’t know…
Who was Scribbs? It sounds like he was well-liked on this forum.
Do you have a title for your book yet? And as movie junkie friend of mine once said ‘’there’s never a bad bad guy in movies or books!’’
Yes, you are right, thinking about it now, I can see why the book can be seen as ‘’romanticising’’ about the topic I suppose. Discussing pooping and catheters in details, the publishers probably figured ain’t gonna be shifting many books!?
I don’t think the book was meant to be an ‘’educational’’ piece on paralyses, but hey, if it got me (a fully AB person) to actually search for a forum like this and ask questions (in a non-deviant way!), then that it can’t be all that bad?


Julibugs
Thanks for voicing your opinion. You raise many valid points which to be honest, I hadn’t really thought about post-reading the book.
I think there was one mention of emptying the bag – yes, I know – ONE, Lou talks about carrying the warm liquid and how it did not faze her. Anyway, like I said, I think that was the only mention with regards to emptying, etc.
To be honest, I don’t know if the author spoke to any of the relevant organisations, I would have thought she would have, as any good writer would do comprehensive research prior to tackling a complex issue such as this.
As you say, how convenient for the herione to hook up a PC system, etc for him. Maybe he just didn't feel like it before but somehow the ''heroine'' opened up something to him and he agreed to it whereas before he adamantly refused (maybe it was a ''whats the point''?). Anyway, that's a side note.
Perhaps the fact that was from a rich family, he was wealthy, goodlooking, had the good life, blah, blah, blah, can afford the best of everything was the author's way of saying, sh** happens, even to people who are viewed as supposedly ''immune'' to such things? Just a thought.

General
The overall impression I get is that obviously not enough mention is made about the daily tasks/trials/tribulations we as AB take for granted, but then again, it is a lot to write about and try and fit in about 400 pages? This particular book could have been written in so many ways and had a different endings, more facts about daily life for someone living with paralyses, etc. The final product could have been different in about 200 different ways. It is a book, I read it and it opened something in me to learn more, discuss, debate and educate myself. I don’t think I could ask for much more really…..I can’t remember when I last read, watched, heard, listened to something that made me think like that and quite frankly, go out of my way to discuss such matters with a community that quite frankly, I’ve never had any exposure to.

[The Black Sheep]

Hi all

The Black Sheep
I have watched The Bone Collector years ago, but now I’m think I need to watch it again, maybe for just more insight as you say? Thx! Perhaps Deaver did more research on the subject prior to tackling it? I don’t know…
Who was Scribbs? It sounds like he was well-liked on this forum.
Do you have a title for your book yet? And as movie junkie friend of mine once said ‘’there’s never a bad bad guy in movies or books!’’
Yes, you are right, thinking about it now, I can see why the book can be seen as ‘’romanticising’’ about the topic I suppose. Discussing pooping and catheters in details, the publishers probably figured ain’t gonna be shifting many books!?
I don’t think the book was meant to be an ‘’educational’’ piece on paralyses, but hey, if it got me (a fully AB person) to actually search for a forum like this and ask questions (in a non-deviant way!), then that it can’t be all that bad?

I didn't mean that you were romanticising the idea of being paralyzed. I actually thought it was meant to be a love story between a man, who just happens to be paralyzed, and a woman. It sounds like a romance novel, somewhat. As for educating people on spinal cord injuries, honestly, that's not a fictional thing and I don't think a fictional book should feel obligated to address certain issues. I didn't know or care about spinal cord injuries until I had one. It's not that I'm insensitive or bitchy, but I honestly just never thought about it. I think when most readers go through the story, they see the man as a man. Not a man attached to a catheter, sitting on the toilet for an hour and then having a care taker clean him up. I think it was totally appropriate to leave that out of a fictional story. We're not all always on the toilet or always concerned with peeing. Sheesh, I would hope that's not how most people see us, and I definitely wouldn't want someone to categorize me like such. We're only victims if we want to be, and I personally wouldn't want to be represented that way. We're all actually normal people... despite being shorter and occasionally running over people's toes. And I totally support anyone interested in the SCI bandwagon, AB or not.

Oh, and Scribbs was one of the nicest, most kind members we had here. I didn't get to know him too well, but he was one of the father-figures on the boards here that, despite being a quad, he was always so optimistic and selfless.

Edited by The Black Sheep, 20 June 2012 - 02:24 PM.

[wheeliebear75]

Over-all we're still primarily the same people as everyone else; we do have a few issues with the whole potty thing....hard to explain why you can't just pop over & say "Hey let's go to lunch." friends need to call my ass up the day before or at least a few hrs ahead of time so I can be PREPARED, & the temp thing at least to ME I just find annoying...have to pack a backpack to bring extra layers in for when I get too cold & the last time I was in 114 although my upper 1/2 was DRENCHED in sweat my legs & feet were dry but WARM (VERY unusual for ME) I was over-heating so we had to wet down my legs & feet with napkins & water from water bottles....it WORKED, shopping with some of my girlfriends.....eh.....cuz like many rock-a-billy gals they like going to boutiques that kinda specialize in that genre of vintage clothing......waaaay un-wheelchair-friendly, but I still LIKE going OUT to concerts & car shows it's just it takes more planning & seeing what the temps will be & wind factors, I still LIKE "shopping" I just don't get to go to the same exact places as my friends.

[Ches]

Havent read the book. Aside from the formalities of our daily routines, I can see the real question underneath it all. I think it once again comes down to us questioning our own worth. I've notably devalued my worth since my injury. They say not to compare yourself to others, but its really hard to understand why someone would want to put up with my burdening ass when there's 3 billion other options out there. And second to that, I can't really seem to swallow the idea of burdening someone else the rest of my days, its just not fair and weighs heavy on me. Datings, companions and all that is great..but to alter someone else's quality of life long term just doesnt seem right. It equally sucks feeling so alone, but suicide has never been a realistic option for me, its not THAT bad!

[KaterinaWit]

I haven't read the book, but then romances aren't my style.

Ches, it seems you are short changing yourself. I'm an AB woman, who loves a T5 complete. Not for one minute do I feel burdened by that love, and the only way that our relationship has altered the quality of my life is to better it. I'm big and ugly enough to look after my own feelings, and it would make me quite cranky if someone else made these choices for me.

Edited by KaterinaWit, 21 June 2012 - 07:18 PM.

[Ratticis]

Don't listen to any of these assholes, I can tell you everything you ever need to know about spinal cord injuries.

First off, SCI doesn't stand for Spinal Cord Injury, it stands for Sadistic Crazy Idiots. All SCI's are injured because THEY ARE EVIL! "God", or as he is known by his friends, Jimmy The Slug, strikes down the evil ones with illness and injuries. The gimps are the worst of all. The higher the injury, the more evil they are. If the gimps change there ways, and have faith in Jimmy The Slug, he might just heal them, provided he's in a good mood and hasn't been drinking. Of course, that is rare. Other ways to possibly beat SCI are to eat lots of fish, or send money to me. Also, avoid the Noble Ninjas of the North. They hate gimps. But don't worry, Ratt's Assasians will take care of them!

Now that we've covered what and why gimps are, lets move on to how they live. Gimps rarely leave their home. Infact, even getting out of bed is a rareity. Gimps eat a fine mush made of fish guts, rice, and wiskey. It's administered in much the same way as those things hampsters drink out of. Some gimps, however, do venture outside. They ocasionally try to fool society into thinking they are something they are not, normal. These are the ones who will never change and will eventually take over the world. The only way to stop them is to take them down. So if you're out and about and see a gimp, push them down and throw gas on them and light them on fire! Gimps hate fire.

Gimps rarely wash, and if they do it is only by somebody with a pressure washer heling them. Gimps do not go to the bathroom. All of their internal organs have been converted into a weaker form of kryptonite. This Crytonite, as it is known, combines with the whiskey they ingest and that spawns more gimps. Eventually, the gimps will overthrow the world, and there will be ramps EVERYWHERE!

Gimps are permantly attached to their wheelchairs. Their beds have ramps on them. Gimps cannot have sex, but like to pretend they can so nobody feels sorry for them. The gimps primary objective is to cause trouble for everyone else, and to throw salt on Jimmy The Slug.

I think that's about it . . . at least all I'm willing to share with an outsider.

[Scarlet1975]

Ratticis
Sooooo……basically you’re telling me, never f**king mind the Zombie Apocolypse…watch out for the Gimp Apocolypse?
Thanks.
I’ll bear that in mind.

*ahem*

So by definition, if there is one day ‘’gimps’’( I hate that word btw, but ok, whatevs, I’ll go along with your little game for now…) everywhere one day, does that mean, by definition, the parking issue will be switched around? AB-bodied people will become a rarity and we’ll get the good parking spots upfront right outside the shopping centre door?
Hmmm…<she says thoughtfully whilst stroking her Persian white kitty on her lap>
I’m down with that.

Ps – I would like to reiterate, I am in no way insulting anyone or being insensitive or unkind, this is just my humour and when I see a post like Ratticus – I kinda feel it gives me licence to ‘’run with it’’ *ahem*.
If I do offend anyone, please tell me. But at the same time, I don’t want to be, either obviously or subtely, patronising or condescending. I just don’t want to feel like I’m walking on egg shells on this forum.


Ches
Listen to KaterinaWit – never a truer word spoken. I’ve spent years ‘’measuring’’ myself against other people and still continue to this day, although not so much, but it's still there, that niggly feeling and thought. It is exhausting. It sounds cliché but it is true – someone said, you make a better first rate you, than a second rate copying somebody else. I suppose it’s easy for me to say such things because I don’t have any of the difficulties you face on a daily basis that you have, but…uhm…yeah….
Sometimes those 3 billion options out there…come with a whole host of other problems and issues that are hidden from the surface and only come out behind closed doors, hidden away from other people and you're left thinking 'oh my soul, how did I miss that?!''. We get sucked in by the perceived ‘’awesomeness’’ of it all on the surface. As one who speaks from experience, trust me, it ain’t all what its cracked up to be. So open yourself up to the possibility. I look forward to how this story unfolds and develops!

[Edinburgh Colin]

Ches,
I know exactly what you mean about not valuing yourself as much any more. My wife is a Counselor and Psychotherapist and is always telling me to say "I value myself" I am worth it" and to not short change myself. Her point is I am still the same person she fell in love with and I should not be trying to decide for her what is best for her or what she needs long term.
Now that all sounds like good stuff, but I'm kind of stubborn and still think of myself as less of a man than I was for various reasons I'll not go into but even no longer being able to change light bulbs on the ceiling figures in my judgement!

So I have one thing to say to you "Lighten the F**k Up on yourself" give yourself a break, it's tough enough coping with what we do without trying to burden ourselves with other people opinions or possible burdens too, they are grown up and can take care of themselves.

Smile and be happy, like a shining flower you will attract attention, not from nasty bugs 'n stuff either, beautiful birds are more the mental image I had.

We love you so let others try too.

EC.

[greybeard]

Nice post Colin. He's absolutely right Ches. Well, at least he (a Scots geezer in a skirt) and I (just your average old perv) love you to bits! I'm sure there are many much more suitable suitors out there. It's just a case of waiting until you stumble across one. It will happen.

Edited by greybeard, 22 June 2012 - 01:14 PM.

[Tetracyclone]

Ches,
I know exactly what you mean about not valuing yourself as much any more. My wife is a Counselor and Psychotherapist and is always telling me to say "I value myself" I am worth it" and to not short change myself. Her point is I am still the same person she fell in love with and I should not be trying to decide for her what is best for her or what she needs long term.
Now that all sounds like good stuff, but I'm kind of stubborn and still think of myself as less of a man than I was for various reasons I'll not go into but even no longer being able to change light bulbs on the ceiling figures in my judgement!

Colin, about most any SOB out there can change a lightbulb (except us, of course), but your wife shows no interest in sleeping with them. It's what you can do in the dark, Babe.

Scarlet_ You offend me. Quit apologizing or Rat will send his Ninjas for you.

Edited by Tetracyclone, 22 June 2012 - 06:40 PM.

[Ratticis]

The Gimped Zombie Appocolypse is the big one.

Now about this whole "I suck and am worthless" thing. WTF? I mean, really. So lets say yer not gimped and found someone, but then get to be 80 years old and don't move as fast as you used to. So would you feel bad then for holding the other person up? Nobody should be judged on what thewy can't do, but what they can.

[The Black Sheep]

Do ninjas ever give a refund?

[Ratticis]

NO REFUND! Only death!

[wheeliebear75]

Havent read the book. Aside from the formalities of our daily routines, I can see the real question underneath it all. I think it once again comes down to us questioning our own worth. I've notably devalued my worth since my injury. They say not to compare yourself to others, but its really hard to understand why someone would want to put up with my burdening ass when there's 3 billion other options out there. And second to that, I can't really seem to swallow the idea of burdening someone else the rest of my days, its just not fair and weighs heavy on me. Datings, companions and all that is great..but to alter someone else's quality of life long term just doesnt seem right. It equally sucks feeling so alone, but suicide has never been a realistic option for me, its not THAT bad!

Wow Ches.....I kinda know where that mentality comes from.....but at the same time..... When I read that to my B/F al he could say was "WOW!!! I'm glad you took a chance on me, I fell in love with you the moment I saw you & it didn't matter what you could or couldn't do, you've loved me & made me smile & laugh & that's all I wanted from you.". There are a lot of people who will only see the what we can't do's....but every last one of them would be the sort to leave if their able-bodied spouse BECAME disabled, the w/c's act as a filter when in the dating scene, those who are about as deep as a puddle may not give you a 2nd thought......but some guy somewhere at some point is going to think about you every minute of the day, not because of pity but because you rolled on in & rocked his world! Don't give up.....please?

Don't listen to any of these assholes, I can tell you everything you ever need to know about spinal cord injuries.

First off, SCI doesn't stand for Spinal Cord Injury, it stands for Sadistic Crazy Idiots. All SCI's are injured because THEY ARE EVIL! "God", or as he is known by his friends, Jimmy The Slug, strikes down the evil ones with illness and injuries. The gimps are the worst of all. The higher the injury, the more evil they are. If the gimps change there ways, and have faith in Jimmy The Slug, he might just heal them, provided he's in a good mood and hasn't been drinking. Of course, that is rare. Other ways to possibly beat SCI are to eat lots of fish, or send money to me. Also, avoid the Noble Ninjas of the North. They hate gimps. But don't worry, Ratt's Assasians will take care of them!

Now that we've covered what and why gimps are, lets move on to how they live. Gimps rarely leave their home. Infact, even getting out of bed is a rareity. Gimps eat a fine mush made of fish guts, rice, and wiskey. It's administered in much the same way as those things hampsters drink out of. Some gimps, however, do venture outside. They ocasionally try to fool society into thinking they are something they are not, normal. These are the ones who will never change and will eventually take over the world. The only way to stop them is to take them down. So if you're out and about and see a gimp, push them down and throw gas on them and light them on fire! Gimps hate fire.

Gimps rarely wash, and if they do it is only by somebody with a pressure washer heling them. Gimps do not go to the bathroom. All of their internal organs have been converted into a weaker form of kryptonite. This Crytonite, as it is known, combines with the whiskey they ingest and that spawns more gimps. Eventually, the gimps will overthrow the world, and there will be ramps EVERYWHERE!

Gimps are permantly attached to their wheelchairs. Their beds have ramps on them. Gimps cannot have sex, but like to pretend they can so nobody feels sorry for them. The gimps primary objective is to cause trouble for everyone else, and to throw salt on Jimmy The Slug.

I think that's about it . . . at least all I'm willing to share with an outsider.

That's a 5 out of 5 on the sarcasm rating system....don't mind Ratti....he just O.D.'d on his sarcasm pills...AGAIN.

I haven't read the book, but then romances aren't my style.

Ches, it seems you are short changing yourself. I'm an AB woman, who loves a T5 complete. Not for one minute do I feel burdened by that love, and the only way that our relationship has altered the quality of my life is to better it. I'm big and ugly enough to look after my own feelings, and it would make me quite cranky if someone else made these choices for me.

Sooo glad you've chimed in!

Ches,
I know exactly what you mean about not valuing yourself as much any more. My wife is a Counselor and Psychotherapist and is always telling me to say "I value myself" I am worth it" and to not short change myself. Her point is I am still the same person she fell in love with and I should not be trying to decide for her what is best for her or what she needs long term.
Now that all sounds like good stuff, but I'm kind of stubborn and still think of myself as less of a man than I was for various reasons I'll not go into but even no longer being able to change light bulbs on the ceiling figures in my judgement!

So I have one thing to say to you "Lighten the F**k Up on yourself" give yourself a break, it's tough enough coping with what we do without trying to burden ourselves with other people opinions or possible burdens too, they are grown up and can take care of themselves.

Smile and be happy, like a shining flower you will attract attention, not from nasty bugs 'n stuff either, beautiful birds are more the mental image I had.

We love you so let others try too.

EC.

VERY WELL said EC!

[StillFingers]

This life isn't always fun, AB or SCIed, routine never is. If all you see yourself is routine, no spontaneity, no wants, no desires, are you truly living? Ches, IMHO your issue isn't SCI, it's one of your questioning if monogamy is what you truly want in life. Some can not be with just one person...forever...this is not a wrong thing, it's just not the norm, or is it?

Each of us has our own agendas, if we do not stay true to them what do we have...nothing in my book, nor can we honestly share, love another. None of us knows our fate, that is why the moment is of so much import...lie not to self, I know it's hard not to....do your best to live; cry, be sad, smile, love if you can, anyone you can, for as long as it lasts.

Some measure of love is better than none, for some it's just a grain or two of rice that brings joy!

[Ches]

I appreciate all the kindness and feedback guys I honestly wasnt fishing for anything. I can just sympathize with the characters feelings, seems a few of us can. You guys are right when you say it is the other persons decision, not mine ultimately. Im a bit of a knucklehead, gotta beat it into me.

Jerry your analysis is pretty dead on..didnt think that part could possibly seep thru. There is a bit more to the story, always is. But yeah for the most part I cant imagine being stuck with someone, or someone being stuck with me. And perhaps, without the chair, I would find some other excuse. Maybe this thread isnt for my partaking!

In some sense, I think us self doubters do it with the best of intentions. Im not trying to dictate someone's life per se, I just know my hardships and would hate for someone else to miss out on things simply b/c they worry about me.

Edited by Ches, 24 June 2012 - 05:38 PM.

[Scarlet1975]

]


That's a 5 out of 5 on the sarcasm rating system....don't mind Ratti....he just O.D.'d on his sarcasm pills...AGAIN.


yeah, no worries, I'm just worried when the effect of the sarcasm pills starts to wear off, I mean....what if an immunity to these sarcasm pills starts to build up in Ratticis's body and he <shudder, leans in to conspiracy whisper> starts being nice?!!
Apocolypse indeed then...

[wheeliebear75]

]


That's a 5 out of 5 on the sarcasm rating system....don't mind Ratti....he just O.D.'d on his sarcasm pills...AGAIN.


yeah, no worries, I'm just worried when the effect of the sarcasm pills starts to wear off, I mean....what if an immunity to these sarcasm pills starts to build up in Ratticis's body and he <shudder, leans in to conspiracy whisper> starts being nice?!!
Apocolypse indeed then...

He CAN BE "nice".....I think the trick is to make him laugh.....but I've been wrong before.

Edited by wheeliebear75, 25 June 2012 - 11:06 PM.

[Ratticis]

If I'm "nice" it usually means I'm up to something . . . I mean . . . Pay no attention to the man behind the curtin!