[Jan]

Hi Every one, I am a South African trained Safari Leader that has help someone that are paraplegic disabled on a Safari before, the outcome was amazing they loved it and it made me feel fantastic giving something to someone that cant just get it when ever they like. This has realy inspired me and I am thinking of starting an Overland Safari Company only for paraplegic disabled people and I am trying to find out what the needs are and the interest for this kind of adventure holidays. Any replies or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. The package I would like to put together would be an overland trip camping in tents with outdoor cooking, "safari walks" well, addapted off road wheelchairs that we could go and explore the wildlife, specially addapted 4x4 quad bike safari and canoeing and who knows what else, just that outdoor in the open experience. Let me know what you think.

Thank you

Jan (Yan)

[keeptrukin]

Jan, on Nov 4 2006, 08:31 AM, said:

Hi Every one, I am a South African trained Safari Leader that has help someone that are paraplegic disabled on a Safari before, the outcome was amazing they loved it and it made me feel fantastic giving something to someone that cant just get it when ever they like. This has realy inspired me and I am thinking of starting an Overland Safari Company only for paraplegic disabled people and I am trying to find out what the needs are and the interest for this kind of adventure holidays. Any replies or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. The package I would like to put together would be an overland trip camping in tents with outdoor cooking, "safari walks" well, addapted off road wheelchairs that we could go and explore the wildlife, specially addapted 4x4 quad bike safari and canoeing and who knows what else, just that outdoor in the open experience. Let me know what you think.

Thank you

Jan (Yan)

just a suggestion, but maybe broaden who you serve. There are alot of people with other types of disabilities that you could help just the same as someone with para. We have a sailing group out where I live that serves all physical disabilities. I'm sure there are exeptions based on safety and needs.

Other than that I think thats a wonderful idea.

I have been on a safari in Kenya and really enjoyed it. I think just having the provisions for a handicap person would help, like ways to get into and out of boats, vehicles set up for chairs or easy transfers, handicap tents, ect....

Hope that helps
KT

[DaveP]

Hi Jan

Interesting idea! You've got my juices flowing!!! Where to start...

I think there is a market for this type of service, but being flexible to suit different people's desires and needs is vital. For example, having vehicles with hand controls would be very strong selling point. Quad bikes also a good idea.

There are plenty of organisations, such a BLESMA (British Limbless Ex-Service Mens Assoc) that already organise annual events and group adventures that would be interested, but, as with all businesses, it's all about cost. If it costs too much, it won't work.

I suppose if you planned a long trek, say from Morocco to Cape Town, you could divide it into sections and offer people the option of the entire trip or just one section, with others joining and leaving at different points too.

I've been looking for a new project to get my teeth into and this sounds very interesting, and challenging. If you're interested, I'm interested in getting involved.

Check out my web site for info on me and my work, and drop me an email if you want to explore this further.

Look forward to hearing from you.
Dave

[milosh]

dave... i agree with you!

i think of offering tours around siberia for disabled. well, since you live in portugal if you go there, your balls will become ice cubes. ;)

[Jan]

Hi Dave

Thank you for your message, the response so far has been great. There are a lot of different aspects we are looking at and maybe get finance from charity organisations for those that cant afford it. Also we are in contact with a few companies that can built or change equipment to our desire to make it easier to control for our clients. You also mentioned gettting involved, if so how would you like to get involved. Nice to hear from you and hopefully we will be in contact again.

Jan

Hi Jan

Interesting idea! You've got my juices flowing!!! Where to start...

I think there is a market for this type of service, but being flexible to suit different people's desires and needs is vital. For example, having vehicles with hand controls would be very strong selling point. Quad bikes also a good idea.

There are plenty of organisations, such a BLESMA (British Limbless Ex-Service Mens Assoc) that already organise annual events and group adventures that would be interested, but, as with all businesses, it's all about cost. If it costs too much, it won't work.

I suppose if you planned a long trek, say from Morocco to Cape Town, you could divide it into sections and offer people the option of the entire trip or just one section, with others joining and leaving at different points too.

I've been looking for a new project to get my teeth into and this sounds very interesting, and challenging. If you're interested, I'm interested in getting involved.

Check out my web site for info on me and my work, and drop me an email if you want to explore this further.

Look forward to hearing from you.
Dave
[/quote]

[DaveP]

"There are a lot of different aspects we are looking at and maybe get finance from charity organisations for those that cant afford it."

I can't see how or why any charity or organisation will provide funding to help you (a business) that intends to provide holiday services to paying clients, even if these clients are disabled. Why would any charitable organisation provide this sort of funding, when you are not a charitable organisation nor are you providing your "services" for charitable cases?


"Also we are in contact with a few companies that can built or change equipment to our desire to make it easier to control for our clients."

You don't need to build/design any special equipment that hasn't already be thought of - no need to re-invent the wheel here, as this has already been done!


"You also mentioned gettting involved, if so how would you like to get involved. Nice to hear from you and hopefully we will be in contact again."

Sounds to me like you and I have very different approaches to this sort of thing, so I'm not sure I want to get involved now. I wish you the very best of luck and if I can be of any assistance please feel free to contact me any time.

[milosh]

dave... i agree! soviet union doesn't exist for a while... so, no chance to get subsidies for a profitable business. you can get investment, sure... but no subsidy. anyhow, the idea of safaris in africa for SCI's is great!

[HiltonP]

Jan . . . there are already two companies running overlander-type safari's in Southern Africa (Epic-Enabled, and Endeavour Safari's) and they have been operating for a number of years now. They have all the kit needed for wheelchair travellers, i.e. vehicle hoist, portable showers/loos, etc. I know the one company reasonably well and I can tell you that their disabled safari side of the business does not make a profit. They've spent a fortune promoting the business (travelling to international tourism expo's, internet, media, etc) but there simply are not enough disabled travellers interested, or able, to pay for the safari. Check things out carefully before you spend any capital.

[Jan]

Hi Hilton,

Thank you very much for your reply and advice, I have to say though that I am completely not into this for the money, obviously I have a family to look after so some sort of finance would be great but not get rich idea. I was looking to go more the charity way either be a charity organization which, I dont know much about or get the company started and have charity organisation sponcering people to go on such a trip. I enjoy the outdoors and the wildlife and all I want is to bring it to those who needs help.

Thank you again and I will certainly keep in mind what you said.

Jan

HiltonP, on Nov 17 2006, 06:39 AM, said:

Jan . . . there are already two companies running overlander-type safari's in Southern Africa (Epic-Enabled, and Endeavour Safari's) and they have been operating for a number of years now. They have all the kit needed for wheelchair travellers, i.e. vehicle hoist, portable showers/loos, etc. I know the one company reasonably well and I can tell you that their disabled safari side of the business does not make a profit. They've spent a fortune promoting the business (travelling to international tourism expo's, internet, media, etc) but there simply are not enough disabled travellers interested, or able, to pay for the safari. Check things out carefully before you spend any capital.

[Jan]

Hi Dave.

I am sorry to find that it sounds a bit like you were unhappy with my reply or my idea. I can acertain you that I am not into this for the money or a get rich quick project, yes, I do need to feed my family tho, but that is the reason I came on here to get ideas or advice from people how to go about it all. I dont know much about charity or even how to set one up all I know is that I love Africa, the outdoors and its wildlife and my biggest satisfaction is to bring it to those that need help. I would either set it up myself as a company and people just have to pay for what they want or try in some way to get sponcers or get help to set up as a charity organisation or find the best way of helping people to get out there and enjoy it as much as I do.

I wasn't trying to re invent the wheel as you implemented but I have spend a lot of time researching certain aspects of what I would like to offer and have not found a company on the net that offers a wheelschair like what I have in mind and a few off them have already offered to do the necesary alterations to my specification and if it goes along it would be tested by people with that disability to see what they think and again Im glad if you know of someone who already does this kind of manufacturing but I dont know who they are and the ones I do know dont manufacture them.

I also don't know what you found so offensive in my offering to you in getting involved, maybe we have different approaches but thats what normally makes it work , people with different ideas, different approaches and different ways of thinking, it doesnt help always having the same approach, a lot off people aproach thing in diferently from each other to make it work for them and for the business, when people work on the same idea it is always great to hear from other people what their aproaches and ideas are so that the best one can be choosed and used for that specific need. I don't know what your speciality is and in what part your interest lies in this whole idea ( you said you would like to get involved) thats why I asked, is it the finance side, running of the business, actually getting out there doing the trip, working on trip planning or ?

I do apreciate your honesty tho and being upfront so thank you for letting me and thank you for the offering of help.

Jan

DaveP, on Nov 15 2006, 04:04 PM, said:

"There are a lot of different aspects we are looking at and maybe get finance from charity organisations for those that cant afford it."

I can't see how or why any charity or organisation will provide funding to help you (a business) that intends to provide holiday services to paying clients, even if these clients are disabled. Why would any charitable organisation provide this sort of funding, when you are not a charitable organisation nor are you providing your "services" for charitable cases?


"Also we are in contact with a few companies that can built or change equipment to our desire to make it easier to control for our clients."

You don't need to build/design any special equipment that hasn't already be thought of - no need to re-invent the wheel here, as this has already been done!


"You also mentioned gettting involved, if so how would you like to get involved. Nice to hear from you and hopefully we will be in contact again."

Sounds to me like you and I have very different approaches to this sort of thing, so I'm not sure I want to get involved now. I wish you the very best of luck and if I can be of any assistance please feel free to contact me any time.

[HollieIzzo]

Hi Jan,

I love the idea of a safari and would definitely consider going on one, finaces permitting.

I think what Dave was trying to get at (sorry if I'm wrong Dave) is that not many charities are going to want, or perhaps be able to, become involved with such an enterprise. Unless the company was on a completely charitable basis, ie exclusively for disadvantaged children - talking finacially disadvantaged more than physically - charities would have a hard job justifying pouring money into a business. Just because your primary target client may be disabled would not qualify you for automatic funding any more than it would if all your clients were female. If you mean funding for an individual's holiday, that is down to whatever charity you have in mind. I am probably wrong but I can only think of ones like Make A Wish Foundation that may consider that, and eligibility for charities like that would not be across the board.

I think you have a nice idea and admire your enthusiasm, however I think the idealsitic image of the business has overridden the reality of the business requirements in your mind.

I am not intending to patronise, it's just that I cannot see the financial viability of the proposal.

A better idea, and please correct me if this is what you intended, is an integrated safari company. If you are able to offer a package regardless of whether you are AB or disabled and regardless of your physical challenge, it may prove viable.

That way, you are not soley reliant on the custom of disabled people, so if the only customers interested in safaris are AB for that particular week, you will not lose out.

Personally, I would like to be able to book a holiday with family/friends and not have to account for my disability, so booking any excursion and not having to make special/alternate arrangements for me would be great.

As I said, I admire your enthusiasm, and I am not sure if you are just talking about adapted equipment - ie adapted for the more challenging terrain found on safari,

"Also we are in contact with a few companies that can built or change equipment to our desire to make it easier to control for our clients."

or whether you mean a whole experience, organised start to finish.

I am a little confused by what you say about the idea, "my biggest satisfaction is to bring it to those that need help" - I take it you mean need extra help compared to an AB person rather that in a charitable sense. No offence meant at all, but if you are doing it out of some misguided feeling that you are helping those less fortunate and performing some greater good, I don't think it will work. If you genuinely want to make the beauty of Africa accessible to more people, which I think is what you do want, then that is great - you obviously have passion for the country. However, I would look into integrated holidays, that way you cover all corners (though I am not sure how viable it would be financially if you have to shell out a lot for adapted vehicles etc). I think you are under the impression that because your client will be disabled, companies would be tripping over themselves to fund/sponser the trip. I don't think this will happen, and you may need to research the market more.

I am more than happy to discuss this with you - I am also curious about the equipment you are talking about having adapted.

Anyway, good luck with it, hope this has helped. If you do want to talk about it more, let me know

[HiltonP]

HollieIzzo, on Dec 13 2006, 05:01 PM, said:

A better idea, and please correct me if this is what you intended, is an integrated safari company. If you are able to offer a package regardless of whether you are AB or disabled and regardless of your physical challenge, it may prove viable.

That is exactly what EPIC-ENABLED and ENDEAVOUR SAFARI's (refer my post above) do.
They would have gone bust years ago if they's relied on disabled clients only.

[andyatneema]

Hi, it is a great idea. We run a craft workshop for disabled people here inIringa Tanzania, right on the route of overlander tours coming up through Tanzania and on the way to Ruaha national park. Do put us on your itinery please if you go ahead with this. check us out at www.neemacraft.com