[Ches]

April 16th I was diagnosed as a T4/T5 complete Para,.. I've never really been around others with paralysis and have since begun to figure things out by my own experience, and research. Yet, there are still many questions I can't find the answers to in any textbooks. I have questions only the victims can answer and I hope to get back as many replies as possible. If you dont want to answer certain questions thats fine, whatever you're willing to share I will appreciate. I'm curious about what ACTUAL feelings are left below the level of injury. For instance, I have constant tingling, I can feel pressure ( if u push on my stomach/back, squeeze my leg..my butt still gets tired after a while of sitting on it) I hear some people are left with pain, others are left with absolutely nothing. I wonder if its really possible for some of you to be badly wounded below the level of injury and unaware? Sounds ridiculous but I've been told by people that they could feel absolutely nothing, even if u chopped their leg off. For those of you who do gain back functions..how did you go about discovering or regaining the use? Can u gain back motor function but no sensory, or vise versa? I can feel a slight temperature response to cold, but it has to be very cold! Is that a good sign? This just recently started for me. I can now flex/use my upper ab and lats, I want to know if other SCI with an injury near mine can also use these muscle. Is this a result of muscle strengthening, or a good sign? And last, what's with spinal shock? How long does it last? How do u know when its over? How did the diagnosis for spinal shock come about? I mean how do u tell if one is still suffering from it? I know this is a lot all at once but I just needed to get it all out..Thanks to all who answer, feel free to ask any questions!

[KimAndSophie]

Ches, on Aug 3 2007, 09:17 PM, said:

I wonder if its really possible for some of you to be badly wounded below the level of injury and unaware? Sounds ridiculous but I've been told by people that they could feel absolutely nothing, even if u chopped their leg off.

Hi, welcome to the board. I'm a c6 complete. I have normal feeling in my neck/shoulders, I can feel pressure in the fronts of my upper arms and just below my neck in the front, and on a tinhy bit of my hands near my thumbs. I can't tell the difference in temperature in these places, and if something is dull or sharp it feels the same. I have no feeling in the rest of my body, and a few months ago I was cooking and spilled a pot of boiling watter over my leg. I didn't feel a thing. When I took my jeans off some of the skin peeled off my leg because it was stuck to my pants. For awhile if I leaned on the area of my leg where the burn was and stayed there for awhile I would get AD but other than that it didn't bother me at all. I still have marks on my leg from it.

I also broke a toe on a door frame and didn't feel it. I heard the crunch and poping sound, and my toe was very swollen and you could move it all the way out to the side of my foot. I'm guessing this should have been a bit painful. I've also smashed my fingers in doorways etc to the point that the skin peeled back and I was bleeding but didn't know until someone told me.

This post has been edited by KimAndSophie: 04 August 2007 - 01:39 AM

[Kev-O]

Ches, on Aug 4 2007, 01:17 AM, said:

April 16th I was diagnosed as a T4/T5 complete Para,.. I've never really been around others with paralysis and have since begun to figure things out by my own experience, and research. Yet, there are still many questions I can't find the answers to in any textbooks. I have questions only the victims can answer and I hope to get back as many replies as possible. If you dont want to answer certain questions thats fine, whatever you're willing to share I will appreciate. I'm curious about what ACTUAL feelings are left below the level of injury. For instance, I have constant tingling, I can feel pressure ( if u push on my stomach/back, squeeze my leg..my butt still gets tired after a while of sitting on it) I hear some people are left with pain, others are left with absolutely nothing. I wonder if its really possible for some of you to be badly wounded below the level of injury and unaware? Sounds ridiculous but I've been told by people that they could feel absolutely nothing, even if u chopped their leg off. For those of you who do gain back functions..how did you go about discovering or regaining the use? Can u gain back motor function but no sensory, or vise versa? I can feel a slight temperature response to cold, but it has to be very cold! Is that a good sign? This just recently started for me. I can now flex/use my upper ab and lats, I want to know if other SCI with an injury near mine can also use these muscle. Is this a result of muscle strengthening, or a good sign? And last, what's with spinal shock? How long does it last? How do u know when its over? How did the diagnosis for spinal shock come about? I mean how do u tell if one is still suffering from it? I know this is a lot all at once but I just needed to get it all out..Thanks to all who answer, feel free to ask any questions!

I am a T-5 as well and i have that tingling sinsation in my legs and on the bottom of my feet and it fills like my butt goes numb if i sit to long does anyone know what that is and if it means anything

[Ches]

Kim,girl, it sounds like u need to be more careful. haha. I have to ask, do you not have any reflex left? Nothing from the super hot, or super cold? Nothing from bumps? My legs still withdrawal themselves and/or stiffen up when appropriate. I assumed everyones did.
As for you kevin,..wanna race? just kidding. I have those same sensations you do. I also have a feeling of my right knee joint. And when I shift I can feel the muscles and spine in my lower back twist, pull, and stretch. Its like playing connect the dots...and losing. How long have you been injured kevin? what got you?

[Kev-O]

Ches, on Aug 4 2007, 02:23 AM, said:

Kim,girl, it sounds like u need to be more careful. haha. I have to ask, do you not have any reflex left? Nothing from the super hot, or super cold? Nothing from bumps? My legs still withdrawal themselves and/or stiffen up when appropriate. I assumed everyones did.
As for you kevin,..wanna race? just kidding. I have those same sensations you do. I also have a feeling of my right knee joint. And when I shift I can feel the muscles and spine in my lower back twist, pull, and stretch. Its like playing connect the dots...and losing. How long have you been injured kevin? what got you?

I have been in my chair for about a year and a half. a sleepy driver got me. Do you also have bad muscle spasms to. I get them all the time and it SUCKS!

[nomis]

Hi Ches
Welcome to the forum.

I’m T4-5 complete from age 21 with 38 years learning post SCI.

I've got a rather lengthy full reply here so if you keep on reading make sure you've got a nice cup of coffee at your side.

I'm curious about what ACTUAL feelings are left below the level of injury.

Certainly in my experience I became more aware of feelings over the first year or two. Motor and sensory nerves don’t follow the same pattern. You can expect some feelings below your injury site – your diaphragm, for instance, get a punch there and it’ll feel as bad as ever. The touch sensation on your skin is easily defined with T4-5 complete but the internal sensations can be subtle.

A burning or tingling sensation of the butt is common but not easily explained. Theoretically, it shouldn’t happen. But the body has ways of sending messages that we don’t so easily understand. In addition to the nerves you control are those of the parasympathetic nervous system which happen automatically – like keep your heart beating. If you consult eastern medicine they talk of energy channels which have gained some credibility in recent years. Subtle messages may be channelled in different, less understood ways.

My feet buzz, too. I quite like it – it’s a warm friendly feeling.

Over the years you’ll likely become more and more aware of subtle messages and what they mean. A persistent chill up my back means time for a shit (and quick). A sweat and ‘odd’ feeling might mean full bladder (headache means much too full).

Sounds ridiculous but I've been told by people that they could feel absolutely nothing, even if u chopped their leg off.

Personally, I’m not about to try this for the sake of finding out. What about the shock and sudden loss of blood? My body is not so stupid as to not know what’s going on. Discomfort usually leads to spasm.

Can you gain back motor function but no sensory, or vise versa?

If you turn out to be incomplete, yes.

I can feel a slight temperature response to cold, but it has to be very cold! Is that a good sign?

Maybe, maybe not. Be aware of it but keep your mind open.
I can’t actually feel that I’ve got cold feet (without touching them) but that cold can begin to affect my whole system – my feet actually feel frozen but IMO it’s my brain that has understood that from info other than the typical sensory nerves. Once I feel cold it can take hours to come right as though my brain has locked into feeling cold.
Some people, suddenly exposed to cold, have their legs fly into spasm.
You’re actually on your own to learn and understand what it means for you.

I can now flex/use my upper ab and lats, I want to know if other SCI with an injury near mine can also use these muscle.

Nada. Not ever a quiver. If you can, you may have an incomplete injury which alters your whole outlook.
My diaphragm (used in breathing) can jelly-move my gut and wiggle all about. But I’ve got a typical para pot indicative of no active abdominal muscles. They used to be tight with spasm but that’s eased off now.

However, some muscles continue to work below your sensory level, particularly those that overlap the sensory level (deltoids). Also, there’s Lat. Dorsi, a lovely strap-like muscle that runs down either side of you back that is hitched high but goes all the way down to your pelvis. It’s designed to help bring your arm down. But in time you will further develop this to also pull on your pelvis – it’s subtle, I’m not talking miracles. It probably adds a little stability and control over your pelvis but not enough to greatly impress anyone (useful, all the same).

There will be other subtle muscle gains. Some partly paralysed muscle groups will not only get strong but more clever in how you use them. Probably too subtle and gradual for you to notice.

And last, what's with spinal shock? How long does it last? How do u know when its over?

Spinal shock is a reaction to the initial trauma. It usually wears off after a couple of days. During that time there is none of the normal tone in the paralysed muscles – no spasms, and muscles and sensory nerves partly affected can be completely knocked out but come around again as the shock wears off. Some people go into total paralysis with spinal shock and later walk out 100% ok – they had no real damage only a sudden bang like knocking someone unconscious.

Hope there’s something helpful there and not just more confusion. Believe me, you’ll go on understanding more as your life goes on. It’d be good to have all the answers now but it’ll be a lifetime. I think it’s important to remember you may be like other paras but you are unique – you are your own pioneer.

I hope you’re on the start of what turns out to be a rewarding journey. I’ve often wondered myself but now, looking back, it’s been a fantastic if unconventional ride (I always did want to be different).

cheers

This post has been edited by nomis: 04 August 2007 - 02:56 AM

[KimAndSophie]

Ches, on Aug 3 2007, 10:23 PM, said:

Kim,girl, it sounds like u need to be more careful. haha. I have to ask, do you not have any reflex left? Nothing from the super hot, or super cold? Nothing from bumps? My legs still withdrawal themselves and/or stiffen up when appropriate. I assumed everyones did.

LOL, I don't really do "careful" I guess. I have muscle spasms but my reflexes are messed up. If I hit my knee really hard against something I might have a reflex but it don't happen all the time. I'm not sure if these are actual reflexes working though, or if it's just muscle spasms. As for my legs or arms pulling away when I touch something really hot etc. that never happens.

[Kev-O]

what about muscle spasms do they ever go away with time or is it something i have to live with. some time they are real bad and other times i dont have any. I am still new to the wheelchair thing and b4 my accident my legs were strong as hell. will the muscles in them ever go away to cuz they sure are heavy

[Ches]

Coffee...mm, nomis you seem to know me well! Thanks for all the info, all of you. You guys Rock. As I first said I havent been exposed to many with paralysis in my days this is all still so new to me. Nomis I appreciate you taking the time to answer EVERY Q! I was diagnosed complete but I think I may have been in shock a little longer than others. I had 6 injuried vertabrate. Luckily only one really messed up my cord and that was my T4, the lower region suffered major compression. Which has subsided to my upper T5 since. I have definitly begin to use muscle I never knew I had in new unique ways. I contribute the build up of my lats and ab to riding in the car. Every turn I dont hold on. I just squeeze real tight to try like I used to balance myself. Somehow that message got through. For that I am so thankful. Back to the compression, because of that I figured it was logical to visit a chiropractor. Have any of you tried this? I have regained the use of my booty, and the feelings in the knee and lower back.
Kevin, no I'm sorry to say I dont have bad spasms. My legs are pretty tame and the so called spasm I have occur after a visit to the chiro. I receive electro stim there, and it tends to make my muscle tense up. But its not a bad thing. Its a normal reaction for an abled body person. Just its involuntary for me. I.E. If I have been sitting too long and I shift they may stretch themselves appropriately or shift to a common position. Does that make sense? They've yet to interfer with my life. I can tell you this though, when I'm in the chair awhile I know they need to move and stretch so every once in a while I will push my knees together and let them tighten up for a sec, or reach beneath my knee and apply pressure to the pressure point cause my legs to tense up a bit. It can be nerve wrecking at first b/c you feel as though you may fall backwards but you wont!
And back to Kim, you sound like me, never paying attention. Fortunately I dont cook! But I do drink too much and end up with 20 broken bones in one night. Thats not too careful!

[Kev-O]

Ches, on Aug 4 2007, 03:01 AM, said:

Coffee...mm, nomis you seem to know me well! Thanks for all the info, all of you. You guys Rock. As I first said I havent been exposed to many with paralysis in my days this is all still so new to me. Nomis I appreciate you taking the time to answer EVERY Q! I was diagnosed complete but I think I may have been in shock a little longer than others. I had 6 injuried vertabrate. Luckily only one really messed up my cord and that was my T4, the lower region suffered major compression. Which has subsided to my upper T5 since. I have definitly begin to use muscle I never knew I had in new unique ways. I contribute the build up of my lats and ab to riding in the car. Every turn I dont hold on. I just squeeze real tight to try like I used to balance myself. Somehow that message got through. For that I am so thankful. Back to the compression, because of that I figured it was logical to visit a chiropractor. Have any of you tried this? I have regained the use of my booty, and the feelings in the knee and lower back.
Kevin, no I'm sorry to say I dont have bad spasms. My legs are pretty tame and the so called spasm I have occur after a visit to the chiro. I receive electro stim there, and it tends to make my muscle tense up. But its not a bad thing. Its a normal reaction for an abled body person. Just its involuntary for me. I.E. If I have been sitting too long and I shift they may stretch themselves appropriately or shift to a common position. Does that make sense? They've yet to interfer with my life. I can tell you this though, when I'm in the chair awhile I know they need to move and stretch so every once in a while I will push my knees together and let them tighten up for a sec, or reach beneath my knee and apply pressure to the pressure point cause my legs to tense up a bit. It can be nerve wrecking at first b/c you feel as though you may fall backwards but you wont!
And back to Kim, you sound like me, never paying attention. Fortunately I dont cook! But I do drink too much and end up with 20 broken bones in one night. Thats not too careful!

your lucky you dont have'em trust me they make life hard. When i first got them i was like sweet im legs are taping and what not. but they get worse atleast in my case. my body will fling backwards and i will flip my chair that sucks. I have done it in school and at home not out on the street yet tho.

[Ches]

So is that how they started out, the spasm that is? My legs tap sometimes. When Im on the bath bench my heels dont reach the ground, but my toes do. My leg will get caught up tapping. I have this cup I keep in the bathtub, I fill it with water before I get out everytime. The next time I get in the water is ice cold. I wait until halfway through my shower, when I'm good and warm, then unleash the water on my legs or just feet. It sends a reflex through my whole body. I literally have to hold on before I start, drop the cup and use the other arm to also latch on to something sturdy. It feels so intense and scary at the same time. Im sure thats a stupid place to test myself but I'm dumb like that. Anyways the cold sends a shock to my legs and feet, an intense feeling thats hard to trigger any other way. Its a great stimulant. My doctors think Im crazy but they like the idea of the intense temperature change and testing those sensations. I recommend silly things like that. Give your legs a reason to flex and control the spasms, you never know you may be able calm them down. Its just mixed signals gettin through. From what I understand AD can cause the spasms, but a common reason is just simply your lower bodies muscle memory knows something has changed. (your mobility) try to work your lower body out and trigger those spasms in controlled enviroment. If you believe in the power of "Energy" then you know that energy needs to go somewhere. Tame the beast! haha .. Lord I need to lay off the pot. Oh yeah Pot that helps with the spasms. My legs get heavy and lazy when Im stoned they dont stretch even if triggered. Do you take medicine for your muscles?

[Kev-O]

Ches, on Aug 4 2007, 03:52 AM, said:

So is that how they started out, the spasm that is? My legs tap sometimes. When Im on the bath bench my heels dont reach the ground, but my toes do. My leg will get caught up tapping. I have this cup I keep in the bathtub, I fill it with water before I get out everytime. The next time I get in the water is ice cold. I wait until halfway through my shower, when I'm good and warm, then unleash the water on my legs or just feet. It sends a reflex through my whole body. I literally have to hold on before I start, drop the cup and use the other arm to also latch on to something sturdy. It feels so intense and scary at the same time. Im sure thats a stupid place to test myself but I'm dumb like that. Anyways the cold sends a shock to my legs and feet, an intense feeling thats hard to trigger any other way. Its a great stimulant. My doctors think Im crazy but they like the idea of the intense temperature change and testing those sensations. I recommend silly things like that. Give your legs a reason to flex and control the spasms, you never know you may be able calm them down. Its just mixed signals gettin through. From what I understand AD can cause the spasms, but a common reason is just simply your lower bodies muscle memory knows something has changed. (your mobility) try to work your lower body out and trigger those spasms in controlled enviroment. If you believe in the power of "Energy" then you know that energy needs to go somewhere. Tame the beast! haha .. Lord I need to lay off the pot. Oh yeah Pot that helps with the spasms. My legs get heavy and lazy when Im stoned they dont stretch even if triggered. Do you take medicine for your muscles?

i sure do. dont know how to spell it tho. Thats how my spasms started to its fun at first but it will get old my legs can somtime be trigerd my just touching them. if i take them off the foot board the will go strate and its hard to make them bend again. Some times it fills like i have diffrent stages of spasms. some time they tap, go strate out, pull in, or just rase off the foot board. I have a pump in me that pumps medicine onto my spine but that does not always work. The spasms will be bad for a cople days then they will go away for a few days then they come back.

[hockeydahc]

you're sounding a lot like what I went through. after therapy ended, I never really got to talk to someone else with an SCI. took me 4 years. you're doing way better. I went into a fantasy world and became a recluse of sorts, and never sought out anyone to answer my questions. I just went through each day unsure if what I was experienceing and doing was common or normal. now that you're here ask away!!

I was diagnosed complete but found out its incomplete. my legs are weaker, and very flabby, but theres muscle in there, it's just not toned at all. size wise, didnt get much smaller and it all blobs out when I sit, and I feel disproportioned, though I'm not, just look it. I have mostly full movement little sensation... and I've heard the reverse firsthand. I have a line at my injury level that is dead to sensation. from there down it's some, but varies from alright, to bad, to hardly in different areas.
I do have reflex reactions to cold, not much on hot.

Keep working on what you're doing. the car ride workouts show ingenuity.

[Ches]

wow thats so weird to me, full movement little sensation. So you walk with a cane? All the time, or just short distance? Why havent your muscles toned up? Thats sounds awfully pecular... You can walk but dont have tone.. How did you get hurt?

[smokymtn memories]

Hi Ches, I'm C4-6 incomplete and like everyone has said, no two alike. I can walk with a cane. Can't feel cold or hot worth a darn, like Kim can be burned or cut without knowing it. I can feel more with my left hand than my right. If I'm drying my hair, since surgery I can use my right hand to do it, but I have to use my left to see if it's dry.

I have a lot of burning, stabbing pain in my hands and burning from the waist down. Never stops, sometimes horrible and sometimes just know it's there. I take Gabapentin three times a day to control the burning and spasms. It helps.

I also have places, such as my right hand, that although I can't feel cold, hot, dull, or sharp; it's overly sensitive to touch. Weird!

[KimAndSophie]

smokymtn memories, on Aug 4 2007, 10:51 AM, said:

I also have places, such as my right hand, that although I can't feel cold, hot, dull, or sharp; it's overly sensitive to touch. Weird!

I have a place like that on the back of my neck. Sometimes even when the neck of my shirt or my hair touches it, it becomes unbearable. I keep my hair up and at a certain length because of this.

[Kev-O]

KimAndSophie, on Aug 4 2007, 04:29 PM, said:

smokymtn memories, on Aug 4 2007, 10:51 AM, said:

I also have places, such as my right hand, that although I can't feel cold, hot, dull, or sharp; it's overly sensitive to touch. Weird!

I have a place like that on the back of my neck. Sometimes even when the neck of my shirt or my hair touches it, it becomes unbearable. I keep my hair up and at a certain length because of this.

I am like that under my arms i hate being touched there

[smokymtn memories]

My legs are so sensitive to touch that most of the time I use a polar fleece blaniket versus sheets and the whole nine yards. Cant' stand the weight of the sheet and blankets.

Kim, you and Nomis have been dealing with sci longer than I, how long can it take for spinal cord swelling to go completely down after surgery? I always forget to ask when I'm at the doctor's.

[Kev-O]

smokymtn memories, on Aug 4 2007, 06:55 PM, said:

My legs are so sensitive to touch that most of the time I use a polar fleece blaniket versus sheets and the whole nine yards. Cant' stand the weight of the sheet and blankets.

Kim, you and Nomis have been dealing with sci longer than I, how long can it take for spinal cord swelling to go completely down after surgery? I always forget to ask when I'm at the doctor's.

Hey smokymtn memories we are right down the road from eachother about 45min's away.

[wheeliebear75]

Hey Chez I know why your doctors think you're crazy to cause muscle spasms. I'm an incomplete and so I do feel the spasms........OMG are they painful! Your muscles are convulsing and I'm not sure that's the same thing as strengthening your muscles.

That jumping thing you talked about if it's my back that does it can be so intense that I start to bend over backwards at L-2 (semi loose vertebra.....it needs a rod & I need the guts and stupidity to do it ) And actually yeah pot is better for my neuropathy than all the Rx drugs, and actually I'm less stoned that way. LOL

L2 incomplete here. I can walk some.......I used to be able to walk further but I'll explain that in a minute. I had a compression fracture that made a posterior lesion (scraped it like a peeled carrot). So I can feel cold but not hot until I'm right at the burn point. I can't feel blunt very well (had someone park an electric scooter on my foot and didn't feel it), I do however feel sharp; and sometimes what feels like a razor blade to me is just my boyfriend's fingernail as he tries to caress. I have terrible neuropathy in my legs......I have to make sure my socks are absolutely smooth. Can't wear the fuzzy cotton kind, I have to buy the knit or nylon socks or else it feels like sand is in my shoe. I also get more burning sensations on my butt and the backs of my legs than on the tops. I have some muscle in the thighs......but you can feel it squish as you run your hand around the leg towards the back no matter how hard I flex that thigh muscle. My calf muscle although not atrophied is very squishy. I swim all the time.....I can kick my legs in the water but there is no real power there.....but I keep doing it anyway just to use them as much as I can. When I do walk I have to use the thigh muscles to pull the legs forward while my arms support the majority of my weight on forearm crutches. Getting up is tricky because I don't have enough muscle control around the knee area to keep them from buckling when I 1st get up (when I do it unassisted I either fall forward which in crutch cuffs can break an arm, or my knees won't hold up and I fall back on my chair or the floor backwards) I need some help mainly for balancing I use my arms to hoist myself up.

I have full use of abdominal muscles.......but I still leak urine sometimes and I have to get to the bathroom quickly or I will have a true accident. I always thought it was your abdominal muscles that controlled that.....nope.

The odd gait I have/had has made my bad back worse. I was getting around farther at one point......but it was kinda a bad thing. I had a physical therapist set me up with braces for my legs. It meant I didn't have the problem of no calf muscles, I just locked the knee brackets and then could swing my body although the lands hurt so he said to walk in a "John Wayne-ish" kinda way. That was where I went wrong. I had an unstable L-2 but it was holding......now I'm supposed to get a rod from T-12 or L-1 to L-4 or L-5. I was told by Children's Hospital to use my crutching abilities as much as I could but to keep in mind that I am still supposed to be using the wheelchair and they figured 50/50 crutches wheelchair. This PT figured he could get me to 75-80% crutches.....now instead of being 1/2 and 1/2 I'm %90 wheelchair and looking at hardware. Sometimes doctors can be wrong......but sometimes they can be right; and now I'm just sorry that I didn't listen to Children's.

Sorry about the length.....just wanted to try and explain at least how I walk + make sure no other incompletes did the same mistake I did all for the sake of "walking". Oh and thanks Nommis for having everyone prepared with their cup of joe. You're the best

[hockeydahc]

well I was in a car accident in sept 01 Month before turning 21.

You're telling me it's strange. learning to walk again witout feeling.

I walk with the cane a lot of the time now. it's not just short distances, but yes, for extended distances I use a chair.

I'm probably not toned in my leg muscles because I'm not using the muscles much. I don;t stand or walk all day. I get where I need to be and sit. Stand if I need to, but i don;t think its significant use. I don't have the endurance. If I flex, my quads can get firm, but I have little hamstring function to balance it out and keep my knees from bending the wrong way. I stand and walk with my knees always slightly bend to prevent this. my legs are weak, and the signals getting to them are poor. regaining the ability to walk does not mean I'm ablebodied. theres no way I could ever run or jump in any sense of the definition. A good day means I'm a little more fluid in my gait, and not walking like Frankenstein's monster. still always looking down to see what they're doing.

if you got more questions ask away.

This post has been edited by hockeydahc: 04 August 2007 - 08:59 PM

[buffie]

I was injured April 6 on Good friday as the result of a car accident. I was told I am a C4-C5 quad. I have feeling all over my body and I can tell whenever I am being touched. I can move both arms and have use of my left hand. I can also pull my left leg in but not possess the ability to push it out. I can wiggle my toes on my foot and strangely enough I can lift my left foot up and down when spasms are happening. I was told I am sensory incomplete and still not sure what that means. Although I am c4-5 I am functioning at the level of a c7. I can feel hot and cold down to my wrists and more on the front sides. I have regained some abs and when I am in my chair I can kick my left leg out if it is lifted slightly.

As this is a new injury for me, I am still coping with my loss of independence. I am still being optimistic about any more return. The dr.'s say spinal shock may take up to 6 months to wear off. I was also told that I have up to 2 years for return, however, I met a lady who regained use of her legs after 6 years. She has the ability to straighten them out and hold them up in the air while laying on her back. So I believe that anything is possible.

As far as spasms go, if I touch anything too hot, my arm instantly jerks and throws the item out although physically I can't tell the temp by my hands. Although the spasms are irritating, I use them to manuever myself into certain positions.

[nomis]

Information regarding SPINAL SHOCK is getting a bit mixed.
I've never heard of it lasting years but obviously there is wide opinion even in medical circles as to how long it lasts, anything from minutes to months.

Here's a simple brief definition from SpinalNet

http://www.spinalnet.co.uk/eendcom/gbcon/f...1256c47005c89f6

"When a spinal cord injury is caused due to trauma, the body goes into a state known as spinal shock. While spinal shock begins within a few minutes of the injury, it make take several hours before the full effects occur. During spinal shock the nervous system is unable to transmit signals, some of which may return once spinal shock has subsided, approximately 2-6 weeks following the injury. The loss of these signals will effect the persons movement, sensation and how well the body’s systems function. Often the persons loss of movement and sensation below the level of the spinal cord injury may appear complete soon after the injury. This may mask the real extent of the damage. Usually, over the first few weeks the some of body systems adjust to the effects of the injury and their function improves. Therefore, during this time it is unlikely that an accurate prediction of any recovery or permanent paralysis can be made."

for more information go to -
http://calder.med.mi...RSING/anat.html

For an even more serious link go to -
http://www.ninds.nih.../detail_sci.htm

[Ches]

Spinal Cord Injuries are so intriguing, I can see how all of us are different. I mean its so obvvious. The cord has it all, the chances of us all having the same outcome are slim. Its still just amazes me, our levels of functionality (is that a word? or did I just make it up)

So how many of you guys have visited Chiropractors, or Massage Therapist? AquaTherapy? What about a lokomat, or something like the RT3000? Any interesting stories about your experiences?

[buffie]

I used massage therapy while an inpatient at Shepherd's for shoulder and neck pain. It worked for awhile but the pain always returns. I was so burned out after 4 mths that all I wanted to do was go home so I did not try anything else.

[Angela250153]

wheeliebear your reply was almost like reading my own syptoms. I am T10-11 incompleted and had a laminectomy just over a year ago. I do not take any medication but I still get spasms eventhough I can cope with them. I get them mostly when I am driving over a bumpy road or when I go around a corner.

I walk on crutches, but when I have been sitting for a long time I start off very badly with my legs crooked and my upper body stooped. It usually takes about 5-10minutes to get to a point where I can walk reasonably well and straight. I still have to use the wheelchar for longer distances. I have fairly good senation in my left leg and can feel hot and cold, but in my right leg I can only feel a bit from the hip to me knee and only a little pressure below the knee.

As you are walking with a cane I would love to know how you have dealt with the balance issue. My balance is still very bad even though I do exercises and sit on a gym ball and do some exercises on that. How long did it take for your balance to reach the point where you could walk with a cane?

Ches in more than a year I have also not met one other person with SCI and it was only after I was discharged from hospital that I was able to do some research on the internet and as was pretty much stuck between work and home I could not even go out to perhaps meet up with other. It is only now that I am driving again that I can go and seek other therapies an hopefully also meet people with similar problems.

I was in Queen Marys on Roehampton for rehab and that hospital is mainly for amputees, people with MS or strokes. I was the only SCI for the whole of the 3 months I was there

Sorry for being so long winded.

Just want to add that after my op I was told that my problems were only temporary. HAHA Over a year on my improvements have been excrutiatingly slow and my walking though better is still ar from normal.

This post has been edited by Angela250153: 05 August 2007 - 09:11 PM

[hockeydahc]

Ches, on Aug 4 2007, 08:57 PM, said:

Spinal Cord Injuries are so intriguing, I can see how all of us are different. I mean its so obvvious. The cord has it all, the chances of us all having the same outcome are slim. Its still just amazes me, our levels of functionality (is that a word? or did I just make it up)

So how many of you guys have visited Chiropractors, or Massage Therapist? AquaTherapy? What about a lokomat, or something like the RT3000? Any interesting stories about your experiences?

I see a chiro weekly. mainly traction for lower back, but he adjusts my spine too. even at teh injury level where I have hardware. it's fused it better not move, but it gets compressed tehre and I feel worlds better after. if you're thinking of it, make sure they take xrays to see what they're doing, and it wouldn't hurt to progress slowly to an adjustment.

yes we are all like snowflakes in our functionality.

[wheeliebear75]

I do do I Angela? LOL Well just a couple vertebra down . Anyway I walk with forearm crutches. And yeah it is kinda hard learning to walk on stilts (that's what I likened it too). At 1st I was on a walker from about 3wks after and then graduated to the forearm crutches after about 4mo. of PT and outpatient rehab (I was only 14 and being the only kid and the only SCI at the time.....I got to do a LOT @ home ONLY because my Mother is an OT). My balance is OK once I'm up.....I just can't get there on my own. The jury is still out as to how much of my balance is a numbness issue vs. muscles just not being strong enough to do the job.

Oh and if you or anyone else like to use the forearm crutches I did a post under equipment/crutches.

[Angela250153]

wheeliebear sorry got the level wrong, but the problems are still very similar. In rehab I started walking between the parralellbars, graduated to the walker and lastly to forearm crutches which I now use most of the time.

Getting up is a tricky business. I can stand up by myself, but then I have the critical point of getting the crutches in each arm. Usually I loose it on the first attempt and crash back onto whatever I have been sitting on. Second or third attempt usually work but then I have to walk a while before I straighten up. After exercises I can walk pretty well with 1 crutch but I always have to keep other hovering above the floor just in case. BTW loss of balance was the main symptom I had pointing at something being very wrong with me.

[smokymtn memories]

Angela, you mentioned how long you've been working to get to where you are now and how vague they were telling you about recovery. Well, I think most of us have learned the hard way that any "recovery" or improvment, takes a heck of a long time!

I think I must have had it in my "hard" head that as soon as I woke up from surgery and my repair job was done, I'd be able to move around again. Then I thought, well maybe after I'm healed completely. Wrong.... Improvements are so small and taking sooooo much time, sometimes you don't even realize you're doing something different or that you're stronger than you were before. I get so frustrated I have to remind myself how far along I am from ten months ago, six, three. Does'nt seem like much, but I'll take back whatever I can get. I've had to do my own PT, it's hard, but it beats the alternative.

We may never walk again like we use to. And a chair will probably still be a good choice in some circumstances. But I figure I'll be glad to take back whatever I can get.

Balance and getting up is still an issue for me as well. I can't even sit on our couch. Can't get my rear up from the low sitting thing! I have a spasm issue when I first stand up, I've learned...........do not try to walk till it's over!

I hope you continue to do well....................