13 replies to this topic

[bantughost]

Hi,
I've been hovering around here for a long minute but didn't participate, just been reading the posts. Cool site. Is there any one else who got injured playing sports? I'd be interested to hear from you especially if you were injured playing rugby. How you got injured [collapsed scrum, high tackle, etc?] level of injury, severity, treatment you receieved, any return, how you're doing now, are you engaged in any sports now, etc.

[WilliamLX]

bantughost, on Sep 13 2008, 09:43 PM, said:

Hi,
I've been hovering around here for a long minute but didn't participate, just been reading the posts. Cool site. Is there any one else who got injured playing sports? I'd be interested to hear from you especially if you were injured playing rugby. How you got injured [collapsed scrum, high tackle, etc?] level of injury, severity, treatment you receieved, any return, how you're doing now, are you engaged in any sports now, etc.

I did not recieve my back injury playing rugby (but still suffer from shoulder damage caused by rugby when I was 17 (22 years ago). When I was playing rugby for school, one of my team mates got his neck broken at c5/6 (collapsed scrum) and has spent the rest of his life in a wheel chair. My young brother-in-law lost the chance to realise his dream of joining the Royal Navy because of severe knee damage caused while playing rugby at school. All in all I think this barbaric sport should be banned, especially from schools.

[bantughost]

You seem very passionate about this? I hear and respect where you are coming from though, I guess. A collapsed scrum huh? That’s definitely consistent with the statistics out there. One piece of research I came across showed that in rugby union scrums are the leading cause of spinal cord injury. Tackles are the leading cause of similar injuries in the rugby league, the game’s other code. The [reported] incidence of all forms of injury, s.c.i included, seems lower in rugby league. The first hint perhaps that sports codes/rules do minimise the risk and incidence of injury?

I received my injury playing rugby. That said, I still don’t think banning rugby is a solution to anything. To begin with that option is just not practical. Don’t get me wrong, I am not advocating for the maintenance of the status quo. There is definitely a need for changes. I personally don’t support contested scrums in primary school rugby for instance. That’s always an accident waiting to happen. Speaking more broadly, I think rugby code reform, particularly with regard to scrum and tackling rules, is the better and more practical option to outlawing the game. A better adherence to rules already on the books with regards to scrums, high tackles, spear tackles etc would be a great start.

At the risk of digressing from the topic at hand, like I said before, yes rugby does have a bad reputation when it comes to cases of deaths and catastrophic injuries. This view generally seems to be based more on subjective preconceptions in my opinion. People generally decide what they think about this topic and stick to their guns regardless of the facts. Research figures don’t really back up the “barbaric sport” tag that rugby has long been slapped with. I’ve actually heard that statement or some variation of it said a lot; “rugby is a barbaric sport”. However, if the incidence of deaths and life altering spinal cord, head or other injuries among participants is the basis for making such a statement then that tag is unfounded. I am trying to be as objective as possible here although I am also consciously trying not to sound defensive. I was looking at the poll on causes of spinal cord injury here on this site and even that points at the fact that sports/recreation in general are far from being the leading cause of spinal cord injuries. Other research findings I have come across suggest that only about 9% of spinal cord injuries are as a result of sports accidents. That is compared to about 11 % from acts of violence and slightly over 20% from falls. If you dig deeper and breakdown these numbers, I bet you that taking a walk down to the corner shop or cleaning out drainage and carrying out some DIY home repairs sounds very dangerous.

Things are not so clear cut when it comes to deciphering sports accident caused injuries. To begin with I found that some researchers have used incidence in general population as opposed to incidence per number of active participants in each particular sports discipline. Using this approach, average amounts of injuries and/or deaths in say boxing are way lower than in football [soccer] mainly because there are more people who play football around the world than those that box. I am certain, however, that a more focused study of average numbers of injuries and deaths per 100,000 active boxers and 100,000 active footballers would reveal that football is less dangerous than boxing… in terms of trauma caused deaths at least.

By the way, whichever way you look at it, there are more deaths and injuries in football than in rugby [my personal experience and online research suggests this]. The above statement makes football sound “oh so barbaric” doesn’t it? That’s just on the surface of course because a good portion of football deaths arise from what researchers call “indirect” causes. Heart failures, heat stroke to name but two of the most common causes of mortality itemised. The incidence of head and neck injuries [as well as other injuries like broken bones] used to be high too a decade or so back, especially among goal keepers. Progressive FIFA code changes over time that have given greater protection to goalies and outlawed tackling from behind have reduced head and career ending ankle injuries. Head and spinal cord injuries still do occur of course, e.g. a high profile case is that of Chelsea FC goal minder Peter Chec [head injury]. Note that only high profile top level league injuries usually get the spot-light and not the Sunday afternoon park footballer who gets his scull cracked or ankle broken.

In the light of such data, looking at the root cause of injuries in sports and addressing the problem through code change is my preferred approach to this problem. I feel the football examples above support this approach. American football rules changes over the decades e.g with respect to spear tackling, helmet design, gum guard use etc have also reduced injury and deaths. As for rugby being rather like American football without the protective gear… that’s stretching things a bit isn’t it? Despite the protective gear, neck and head injuries and deaths [including death from “indirect causes], especially in high school football is higher than in rugby. If you look at things objectively, it’s a no brainer really even without producing numbers to support this fact. The two games are played according to two very different codes especially when it comes to tackling and scrimmage [the leading causes of neck and head injury] in both. E.g with or with out the ball in American football… you’re going down, seemingly by whatever means necessary. Under both codes of rugby [union and league], only the ball carrier can get tackled. Even the type of tackling allowed is regulated, e.g no spearing, no high tackling, no clothes line tackles...

“Encouraging participation in sport and recreation… is a major public health priority internationally because of the rising rates of obesity and the potential for an increase in diseases related to a sedentary lifestyle”. The consequences of obesity pose a far greater risk than sports. Of course participation in sport is not without risk. But the risk involved is low. I still maintain that formulating and putting in place preventive measures to minimise this risk even more is the way forward [in any sport]. I would be glad if some one would objectively convince me otherwise.

Sports accidents are responsible for less than 9% of catastrophic spinal cord injury. Rugby related spinal cord injuries account for a very minuscule fraction of sports accident caused accident. I am a rugby caused sci statistic but I’m not bitter. Yes this sucks… a lot at times, but I reason that I could have buggered my neck playing football, swimming or, more likely, driving to or from one of my football or rugby games if statistics which say road traffic accidents are the leading cause of spinal cord injury are to be believed. There are less sci’s in rugby than in American football. Neck injuries are more likely to occur playing rugby than real football [soccer] I suppose but overall there are generally more injuries in football than rugby. I played both sports competitively up to university level i.e. up to the time I got injured and think I can claim to know something about this from experience. Yet neither of these sports/recreation activities qualify for the coveted title of the leading cause of spinal cord injuries. So if we were to start of by banning rugby [and reduce sci incidence by point-something of a percent] then we would have started off down a slippery slope to who knows where.

Statistically speaking, in terms of deaths and spinal cord, head and other injuries, the most "barbaric sports"are [Victoria, Australia study] motor and powerboat sports, equestrian sports and diving/swimming. Should these sports be next on the chopping board? More importantly, post injury, should para or quads even consider participating in motor, water and other sports for that matter, especially if their injury was from a sports accident?

Ps: too lazy to add more website links to substantiate all my claims here. Perhaps I’ll do so later but you can google some of this stuff.

Edited by bantughost, 27 September 2008 - 08:47 PM.

[Bevan-L]

bantughost, on Sep 28 2008, 07:45 AM, said:

Statistically speaking, in terms of deaths and spinal cord, head and other injuries, the most "barbaric sports"are [Victoria, Australia study] motor and powerboat sports, equestrian sports and diving/swimming. Should these sports be next on the chopping board? More importantly, post injury, should para or quads even consider participating in motor, water and other sports for that matter, especially if their injury was from a sports accident?

Ps: too lazy to add more website links to substantiate all my claims here. Perhaps I’ll do so later but you can google some of this stuff.

Its funny you mention this cos your post on the 28 Sept 08 is th exact day I had my accident - gust of wind blew my motorcycle off the road into a soil embankment at around 100km/h. But that hasnt stopped me from participating in motorsport, something i've done all my life, and i'll be back on track in the new year!

[Tetracyclone]

Interesting cross cultural study in Taiwan showed that SCIs there were about 4% sports related compared to 25% in western countries (dunno where they got their stats).

Chinese people tend to think sports risks, or maybe just sports, are weird. It is their scooters and driving that gets them whacked, but they don't consider changing their driving habits.

My conclusion: humans are wonderfully weird. Reducing injury is good but not to the point that you dictate peoples choices.

[guido]

Pwuff, on Dec 17 2009, 02:15 PM, said:

Interesting cross cultural study in Taiwan showed that SCIs there were about 4% sports related compared to 25% in western countries (dunno where they got their stats).

Chinese people tend to think sports risks, or maybe just sports, are weird. It is their scooters and driving that gets them whacked, but they don't consider changing their driving habits.

There's lies, damned lies, and statistics: just ask a politician!
That 4% might not represent how risky sports aren't there, but how risky driving is. Percentages are the easiest way to scew figures.

But agree about not letting inury dictate life: problem with SCI is you hear about all the freak accidents and they cover all manner of normal activities. It would be too easy to start worrying about anyone doing anything if we let it.

[MxDisasterGrl]

Well i'm not called "Mxdisastergrl" for nothin'! I shattered my T12 on my motocross bike while on a supercross track. Had never raced yet, and i was trying to get better. Was my last lap and i guess i was a little fatigued, i dunno....but ya, i'm going to keep doing any and every sport available to me...

[hockey mom]

MxDisasterGrl, on Dec 17 2009, 10:03 PM, said:

Well i'm not called "Mxdisastergrl" for nothin'! I shattered my T12 on my motocross bike while on a supercross track. Had never raced yet, and i was trying to get better. Was my last lap and i guess i was a little fatigued, i dunno....but ya, i'm going to keep doing any and every sport available to me...

I am struggling with weighing the pros and cons of para sports and reinjury, new injury. A friend had a T something from motor cross with good return, not total and then hyperextended in sled hockey and now has a partial quad. I'm the team manager and feel like the potential for re injury is higher in some sports with some diagnoses. It scares me I am selling this sled hockey sport that took her function and maybe her life. My L4 fusion is letting go and I'm loosing it below L4, lol I lost it due to hauling the hockey equipment so I don't even play. I knew someday it would go. I hope to do research and design on para sport euipment that may prevent reinjury. Hoping to present at Amazing leaders conference 2010. Right now my family , ha, me-hockey mom is hauling equipment for wheelchair racing, handcycling and sled hockey. Might add in para swimming for the kids. hmm less equipment to haul, seems safer. Adding swimming so my son can do more than a duathalon. He would like to do a triathalon but he's a sinking rock.

Hockey mom

[MxDisasterGrl]

hockey mom, on Dec 20 2009, 02:38 PM, said:

MxDisasterGrl, on Dec 17 2009, 10:03 PM, said:

Well i'm not called "Mxdisastergrl" for nothin'! I shattered my T12 on my motocross bike while on a supercross track. Had never raced yet, and i was trying to get better. Was my last lap and i guess i was a little fatigued, i dunno....but ya, i'm going to keep doing any and every sport available to me...

I am struggling with weighing the pros and cons of para sports and reinjury, new injury. A friend had a T something from motor cross with good return, not total and then hyperextended in sled hockey and now has a partial quad. I'm the team manager and feel like the potential for re injury is higher in some sports with some diagnoses. It scares me I am selling this sled hockey sport that took her function and maybe her life. My L4 fusion is letting go and I'm loosing it below L4, lol I lost it due to hauling the hockey equipment so I don't even play. I knew someday it would go. I hope to do research and design on para sport euipment that may prevent reinjury. Hoping to present at Amazing leaders conference 2010. Right now my family , ha, me-hockey mom is hauling equipment for wheelchair racing, handcycling and sled hockey. Might add in para swimming for the kids. hmm less equipment to haul, seems safer. Adding swimming so my son can do more than a duathalon. He would like to do a triathalon but he's a sinking rock.

Hockey mom

sounds to me like you ARE over extending/exerting yourself girl!!! I thought i was busy w/ dance, t-ball, school, and groceries....etc...didn't know i could also do all that!!! It also sounds to me like you know enough to make the right decision. I'm also weighing some pros and cons of my own. Both my son and my daughter want to ride motocross. My son especially, but he's only 5 and she's only 7. I didn't have the proper training. I had just started myself, however there are a TON of other guys out there that were PROS and still were paralyzed. I'm just not sure how i could handle it if it were my child. Plus how could i take care of my own child the way i am. I wouldn't be able to really be there for everything they would need if something did happen. On bikes, it's not thing of "if", but a thing of "when" and how "bad" you're going down. I just don't know what to do. I don't want them to feel afraid of everything, and i don't want to say no, don't pursue your dream or passion, but i don't want them to end up like myself either. Such a hard decision to make. Could mean a change forever if i make the wrong one. I just pray for the answer right now, while stalling my kids...lol...hope all goes well for you..

april

[cas]

MxDisasterGrl, on Dec 21 2009, 05:03 AM, said:

hockey mom, on Dec 20 2009, 02:38 PM, said:

MxDisasterGrl, on Dec 17 2009, 10:03 PM, said:

Well i'm not called "Mxdisastergrl" for nothin'! I shattered my T12 on my motocross bike while on a supercross track. Had never raced yet, and i was trying to get better. Was my last lap and i guess i was a little fatigued, i dunno....but ya, i'm going to keep doing any and every sport available to me...

I am struggling with weighing the pros and cons of para sports and reinjury, new injury. A friend had a T something from motor cross with good return, not total and then hyperextended in sled hockey and now has a partial quad. I'm the team manager and feel like the potential for re injury is higher in some sports with some diagnoses. It scares me I am selling this sled hockey sport that took her function and maybe her life. My L4 fusion is letting go and I'm loosing it below L4, lol I lost it due to hauling the hockey equipment so I don't even play. I knew someday it would go. I hope to do research and design on para sport euipment that may prevent reinjury. Hoping to present at Amazing leaders conference 2010. Right now my family , ha, me-hockey mom is hauling equipment for wheelchair racing, handcycling and sled hockey. Might add in para swimming for the kids. hmm less equipment to haul, seems safer. Adding swimming so my son can do more than a duathalon. He would like to do a triathalon but he's a sinking rock.

i know just how u feel- -i had my accident may 28ththis year-now t12 paralysed. my husband and i were very sporty, running everyday, my accident was whilst competing my horse, my husband formerly played a lotof rugby. we have 2 children aged 5 and 3, our son aged 5 will start to play rugby with school next year. my daughter is desperate to ride, undestandably my husband isnt keen but its very difficult-how can u let one do a sport they want to and not the other-i know both are potentially dangerous sports-but i do believe life is for living,not watching. i would hate either my son or daughter to have my injury-but equally i want to let them do what they want......very difficult to decide!!!
Hockey mom

sounds to me like you ARE over extending/exerting yourself girl!!! I thought i was busy w/ dance, t-ball, school, and groceries....etc...didn't know i could also do all that!!! It also sounds to me like you know enough to make the right decision. I'm also weighing some pros and cons of my own. Both my son and my daughter want to ride motocross. My son especially, but he's only 5 and she's only 7. I didn't have the proper training. I had just started myself, however there are a TON of other guys out there that were PROS and still were paralyzed. I'm just not sure how i could handle it if it were my child. Plus how could i take care of my own child the way i am. I wouldn't be able to really be there for everything they would need if something did happen. On bikes, it's not thing of "if", but a thing of "when" and how "bad" you're going down. I just don't know what to do. I don't want them to feel afraid of everything, and i don't want to say no, don't pursue your dream or passion, but i don't want them to end up like myself either. Such a hard decision to make. Could mean a change forever if i make the wrong one. I just pray for the answer right now, while stalling my kids...lol...hope all goes well for you..

april

[Parachute]

I was injured playing rugby on Sun 29 March 2009. I am C3-4 incomplete. I am a walker. Since Sat Jan 30 2010, I have completed six 5km runs and got the time from 35mins 54 secs down to 30 mins 48 secs. I attend Disabled Athletics every week.


Parachute

[Ratticis]

WilliamLX, on Sep 15 2008, 05:19 AM, said:

bantughost, on Sep 13 2008, 09:43 PM, said:

Hi,
I've been hovering around here for a long minute but didn't participate, just been reading the posts. Cool site. Is there any one else who got injured playing sports? I'd be interested to hear from you especially if you were injured playing rugby. How you got injured [collapsed scrum, high tackle, etc?] level of injury, severity, treatment you receieved, any return, how you're doing now, are you engaged in any sports now, etc.

I did not recieve my back injury playing rugby (but still suffer from shoulder damage caused by rugby when I was 17 (22 years ago). When I was playing rugby for school, one of my team mates got his neck broken at c5/6 (collapsed scrum) and has spent the rest of his life in a wheel chair. My young brother-in-law lost the chance to realise his dream of joining the Royal Navy because of severe knee damage caused while playing rugby at school. All in all I think this barbaric sport should be banned, especially from schools.

O please! I got injured after I slipped in the shower, so lets ban showers. Lets ban cars too, because lots of people have been hurt/killed in them. Hell, lets ban anything that might be considered even remotly dangerous.

Fact of the matter is, you know there's risks involved going in, so don't try to preach the 'horrers of sport' after the unfortunite happens.

[Paraplegic Jedi]

I wasn't injured playing sports but I was huge into soccer before my injury, now I just play it on the xbox. A good friend of mine, Coach Arthur Besser, is trying to get people to play a brazilian sport called frescoball in Miami Beach, FL if anyone is interested there is some info here: http://parafrescoball.webs.com

[chickadee]

Quote

O please! I got injured after I slipped in the shower, so lets ban showers. Lets ban cars too, because lots of people have been hurt/killed in them. Hell, lets ban anything that might be considered even remotly dangerous.

Fact of the matter is, you know there's risks involved going in, so don't try to preach the 'horrers of sport' after the unfortunite happens.

Dearest Rat,

I'm sure that the world is pleased that both you, and I, continue to shower in the face of such adversity and unfortunateness. You probably more than I, seeing as how us ladyfolk tend to smell like roses and lavender and glitter 24/7.

Yours very sincerely.